Originally posted by Old School:
I will say this. This whole FFOC drama is sucking the fun right out of the anticipation of football season for me Don't let it. The season is less than two months away and there are great contests out there for us who have a track record of paying out their winners in a timely manner. Don't let the negativity from others impact your passion...it's not worth it.
RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
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Purple Helmets
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RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
Living the dream!
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Guinness Stingers
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RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
quote:Originally posted by FPA - Scott Atkins:
http://url4t.com/1AD
Things are heating up gang!
Unfortunately, the bad news keeps rolling in.
The AFFL has announced they will be OPEN for business in 2010. Their grand prize winner and countless others have significant winnings yet to be paid!
PLUS, the FFOC situation just won't go away. More news is breaking and it's not good for those winners. The late arrivals are pouring in with emails wondering what just happened.
We'll be drawing for some draft slots for some prominent leagues and hopefully we'll find the time to squeeze in some DRAFT SLOT STRATEGY.
11PM EST! TONIGHT! Well Scott, I didn't listen to your show last night but it's good to see that you got the other board all fired up about the FFOC again. And I see that ol' venerable David Dodds is now throwing out all kinds of accusations that he doesn't have any common sense about. This is the same David Dodds who emailed me and Ryan telling us we should leave the 12-team online space because we had no chance against them. And in return their new venture wouldn't enter the 14-team contest area in the future. Sheesh. Go crazy Double-D, go crazy.
You know, I've talked with a lot of the former FFOC players this week and this is a great, great group of fantasy players who are looking for another alternative game this year, one that will pay off their prizes and provide them with a competitive playing field. We are getting all kinds of crossover play right now and you can see it with our Online Championship signups. We have over 210 teams registered right now and we're going to hit 600, I can tell. These folks want to play again in 2010 and I'm glad we're able to reach out to them and talk with them.
I wish all of the free entries had been paid by FFOC's owners too, but that game has left. There is no FFOC in 2010. We sure wish they would have returned too as it was a part of our back-end business, just like the other contests are for RT Sports. But we have our own contests to run and hopefully we can provide an area for these players to compete in.
And as DD knows, he can email me or Ryan with any of those questions if he wants. He certainly knows how to get a hold of us, as do you Scott. [/QUOTE]Greg, how about answering this question that was posted.
Greg Ambrosius
Administrator
Member # 2
Member Rated:
posted July 16, 2010 09:58 AM
quote:
Originally posted by FPA - Scott Atkins:
quote:
Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
[qb]
Greg, did you happen to ask Detsinh if in fact he was paid his full $300,000 and has he been promised the other $700,000? Players want to know.
Thanks!
Scott, I didn't think there was an issue with any of the Las Vegas entrants getting paid, including the grand prize winner. I don't think there's any issue with Detsinh. We're glad to have him in the NFFC and with Fanball, competing in this online format. Maybe he will be the first one to win two national contests. Someone has to be the first to do it and maybe Detsinh will be the one.
--------------------
Founder, National Fantasy Football Championship & National Fantasy Baseball Championship
Editor, Fantasy Sports Magazine
Posts: 11928 | From: Iola, WI | Registered: Apr 2004 | IP: Logged |
Being part owner and w/all the controversy surrounding ffoc and fanball , you go online stating that the million dollar winner has joined NFFC but you don't know if he was paid. Please!!!!! I played ffoc both years, ffoc/stan misthios and fanball owe me the price of 8 Tier 1 and 13 Q-School teams that I won.I also find it interesting that not all ffoc players received your e-mail. Did you omit the ones already registered here? It's interesting that the e-mails and the announcement of the million dollar winner coincided . Did you reach out to him? Did he receive any type of free games ? The only way to resolve the controversy is to answer the questions and not dodge them.
quote:Originally posted by FPA - Scott Atkins:
http://url4t.com/1AD
Things are heating up gang!
Unfortunately, the bad news keeps rolling in.
The AFFL has announced they will be OPEN for business in 2010. Their grand prize winner and countless others have significant winnings yet to be paid!
PLUS, the FFOC situation just won't go away. More news is breaking and it's not good for those winners. The late arrivals are pouring in with emails wondering what just happened.
We'll be drawing for some draft slots for some prominent leagues and hopefully we'll find the time to squeeze in some DRAFT SLOT STRATEGY.
11PM EST! TONIGHT! Well Scott, I didn't listen to your show last night but it's good to see that you got the other board all fired up about the FFOC again. And I see that ol' venerable David Dodds is now throwing out all kinds of accusations that he doesn't have any common sense about. This is the same David Dodds who emailed me and Ryan telling us we should leave the 12-team online space because we had no chance against them. And in return their new venture wouldn't enter the 14-team contest area in the future. Sheesh. Go crazy Double-D, go crazy.
You know, I've talked with a lot of the former FFOC players this week and this is a great, great group of fantasy players who are looking for another alternative game this year, one that will pay off their prizes and provide them with a competitive playing field. We are getting all kinds of crossover play right now and you can see it with our Online Championship signups. We have over 210 teams registered right now and we're going to hit 600, I can tell. These folks want to play again in 2010 and I'm glad we're able to reach out to them and talk with them.
I wish all of the free entries had been paid by FFOC's owners too, but that game has left. There is no FFOC in 2010. We sure wish they would have returned too as it was a part of our back-end business, just like the other contests are for RT Sports. But we have our own contests to run and hopefully we can provide an area for these players to compete in.
And as DD knows, he can email me or Ryan with any of those questions if he wants. He certainly knows how to get a hold of us, as do you Scott. [/QUOTE]Greg, how about answering this question that was posted.
Greg Ambrosius
Administrator
Member # 2
Member Rated:
posted July 16, 2010 09:58 AM
quote:
Originally posted by FPA - Scott Atkins:
quote:
Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
[qb]
Greg, did you happen to ask Detsinh if in fact he was paid his full $300,000 and has he been promised the other $700,000? Players want to know.
Thanks!
Scott, I didn't think there was an issue with any of the Las Vegas entrants getting paid, including the grand prize winner. I don't think there's any issue with Detsinh. We're glad to have him in the NFFC and with Fanball, competing in this online format. Maybe he will be the first one to win two national contests. Someone has to be the first to do it and maybe Detsinh will be the one.
--------------------
Founder, National Fantasy Football Championship & National Fantasy Baseball Championship
Editor, Fantasy Sports Magazine
Posts: 11928 | From: Iola, WI | Registered: Apr 2004 | IP: Logged |
Being part owner and w/all the controversy surrounding ffoc and fanball , you go online stating that the million dollar winner has joined NFFC but you don't know if he was paid. Please!!!!! I played ffoc both years, ffoc/stan misthios and fanball owe me the price of 8 Tier 1 and 13 Q-School teams that I won.I also find it interesting that not all ffoc players received your e-mail. Did you omit the ones already registered here? It's interesting that the e-mails and the announcement of the million dollar winner coincided . Did you reach out to him? Did he receive any type of free games ? The only way to resolve the controversy is to answer the questions and not dodge them.
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Ted's Cracked Head
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- Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2005 6:00 pm
RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
Being part owner and w/all the controversy surrounding ffoc and fanball , you go online stating that the million dollar winner has joined NFFC but you don't know if he was paid. Please!!!!! I played ffoc both years, ffoc/stan misthios and fanball owe me the price of 8 Tier 1 and 13 Q-School teams that I won.I also find it interesting that not all ffoc players received your e-mail. Did you omit the ones already registered here? It's interesting that the e-mails and the announcement of the million dollar winner coincided . Did you reach out to him? Did he receive any type of free games ? The only way to resolve the controversy is to answer the questions and not dodge them. What a bunch of crap. Why should Greg have to ask that player anything and why should it become a topic of interest here? No one here is dodging any questions. If you have questions for that person, ask them yourself.
To be honest, Scott, who is supposed to be representing a group of individuals should know better than to use a message board when trying to establish facts. He should contact that individual and get the facts himself. He should not continue the message board banter that HE KNOWS is bad for all of the interested parties, including the players. To do suggests to me that just maybe he has an agenda or is using poor judgement. Either way it is bad for the game and I would expect more from him or the organization that wants to be my "voice" in the industry.
To be honest, Scott, who is supposed to be representing a group of individuals should know better than to use a message board when trying to establish facts. He should contact that individual and get the facts himself. He should not continue the message board banter that HE KNOWS is bad for all of the interested parties, including the players. To do suggests to me that just maybe he has an agenda or is using poor judgement. Either way it is bad for the game and I would expect more from him or the organization that wants to be my "voice" in the industry.
My mama says she loves me but she could be jiving too! BB King
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Old School
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RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
....I also find it interesting that not all ffoc players received your e-mail. Did you omit the ones already registered here? It's interesting that the e-mails and the announcement of the million dollar winner coincided ....
What email did ffoc players receive? Anyone?
What email did ffoc players receive? Anyone?
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Guinness Stingers
- Posts: 27
- Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 6:00 pm
RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
Originally posted by Rob B:
quote: Being part owner and w/all the controversy surrounding ffoc and fanball , you go online stating that the million dollar winner has joined NFFC but you don't know if he was paid. Please!!!!! I played ffoc both years, ffoc/stan misthios and fanball owe me the price of 8 Tier 1 and 13 Q-School teams that I won.I also find it interesting that not all ffoc players received your e-mail. Did you omit the ones already registered here? It's interesting that the e-mails and the announcement of the million dollar winner coincided . Did you reach out to him? Did he receive any type of free games ? The only way to resolve the controversy is to answer the questions and not dodge them. What a bunch of crap. Why should Greg have to ask that player anything and why should it become a topic of interest here? No one here is dodging any questions. If you have questions for that person, ask them yourself.
To be honest, Scott, who is supposed to be representing a group of individuals should know better than to use a message board when trying to establish facts. He should contact that individual and get the facts himself. He should not continue the message board banter that HE KNOWS is bad for all of the interested parties, including the players. To do suggests to me that just maybe he has an agenda or is using poor judgement. Either way it is bad for the game and I would expect more from him or the organization that wants to be my "voice" in the industry. [/QUOTE]Greg is in ownership w/fanball. He should know if the guy got paid,he dodged the question. Second nobody has heard anything from the guy that won the million until Greg announced 'that he was playing NFFC otherwise I would have asked him. Are you Greg's answering machine. I asked him the question not you. You want to talk about crap. If it smells like **** it is **** so don't taste it.
quote: Being part owner and w/all the controversy surrounding ffoc and fanball , you go online stating that the million dollar winner has joined NFFC but you don't know if he was paid. Please!!!!! I played ffoc both years, ffoc/stan misthios and fanball owe me the price of 8 Tier 1 and 13 Q-School teams that I won.I also find it interesting that not all ffoc players received your e-mail. Did you omit the ones already registered here? It's interesting that the e-mails and the announcement of the million dollar winner coincided . Did you reach out to him? Did he receive any type of free games ? The only way to resolve the controversy is to answer the questions and not dodge them. What a bunch of crap. Why should Greg have to ask that player anything and why should it become a topic of interest here? No one here is dodging any questions. If you have questions for that person, ask them yourself.
To be honest, Scott, who is supposed to be representing a group of individuals should know better than to use a message board when trying to establish facts. He should contact that individual and get the facts himself. He should not continue the message board banter that HE KNOWS is bad for all of the interested parties, including the players. To do suggests to me that just maybe he has an agenda or is using poor judgement. Either way it is bad for the game and I would expect more from him or the organization that wants to be my "voice" in the industry. [/QUOTE]Greg is in ownership w/fanball. He should know if the guy got paid,he dodged the question. Second nobody has heard anything from the guy that won the million until Greg announced 'that he was playing NFFC otherwise I would have asked him. Are you Greg's answering machine. I asked him the question not you. You want to talk about crap. If it smells like **** it is **** so don't taste it.
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Guinness Stingers
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RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
Originally posted by Old School:
....I also find it interesting that not all ffoc players received your e-mail. Did you omit the ones already registered here? It's interesting that the e-mails and the announcement of the million dollar winner coincided ....
What email did ffoc players receive? Anyone? To All Former FFOC players:
As a former FFOC participant we want to present you this exciting offer from the National Fantasy Football Championship. If you sign up and pay by July 21 for an NFFC Online Championship team, you will get $50 off your entry. Sign up NOW and you'll get an entry in the $350 event for only $300. This offer applies to each league you sign up for so if you sign up for multiple leagues, you'll receive $50 off each of your leagues. But you MUST SIGN UP NOW!!
Now in its second exciting season, the NFFC's Online Championship features the HIGHEST payouts in the fantasy industry with $2,100 in league prizes as well as an overall prize of $50,000. First place in each league wins $1,400, with second place earning $700 and both teams advance to the three-week Championship Round where one owner will take home the $50,000 grand prize. Sign up now and then contact Greg Ambrosius at [email protected] to receive the discount.
This SPECIAL OFFER won't last long so take advantage TODAY by signing up at nffc.fanball.com.
But that's not all we're offering today. If you're interested in signing up for any of our Live Events we have them at eight exciting locations this year. They include:
Las Vegas - Bellagio Hotel & Casino
New York - Citi Field
Chicago - Trackside Arlington Park
Boston - Radisson Hotel
Denver - Denver Marriott
Dallas - House of Blues
Buffalo - Seneca Casino
Minneapolis - Minneapolis Hilton
Here's the special FFOC offer through July 21 if you sign up and pay now:
The NFFC Classic - No Events Fee or co-manager fee, a savings of up to $100. The NFFC Classic features a $1,400 entry fee, a league prize of $5,000 and an overall prize of $100,000. NFFC Classic drafts are 14-team leagues with drafts being held on Saturday, Sept. 4.
The NFFC Primetime - No Events Fee or co-manager fee, a savings of up to $100. The NFFC Primetime features an $850 entry fee, a $3,000 league prize and an overall prize of $50,000. These are 12-team leagues with drafts also being held on Saturday, Sept. 4.
The NFFC Auction Championship - featuring an $850 entry fee and an overall prize of $10,000. The Auction Championship will only be held on Friday, Sept. 3 in Las Vegas, New York and Chicago.
The NFFC Draft Champions Championship - featuring an $850 entry fee and an overall prize of $10,000. This draft-only event will be held on Friday Sept. 3 in Las Vegas, New York, Chicago and Boston.
Sign up for any two live events by July 21 and you'll receive the discounts plus an autographed Rich Gannon mini-helmet. The first 25 owners to take advantage of this double-deal will get the mini-helmet of the former NFL MVP.
The NFFC also has affordable private satellite leagues with paybacks of 82% within each league, paying the top three finishers. Entry fees are $125, $250 and $500 per team and they are 14-team leagues with online drafts in July, August and September.
To sign up for any of these events go to nffc.fanball.com and then contact [email protected] for the giveaways and discounts. Good luck and welcome back.
[ July 17, 2010, 04:08 PM: Message edited by: Guinness Stingers ]
....I also find it interesting that not all ffoc players received your e-mail. Did you omit the ones already registered here? It's interesting that the e-mails and the announcement of the million dollar winner coincided ....
What email did ffoc players receive? Anyone? To All Former FFOC players:
As a former FFOC participant we want to present you this exciting offer from the National Fantasy Football Championship. If you sign up and pay by July 21 for an NFFC Online Championship team, you will get $50 off your entry. Sign up NOW and you'll get an entry in the $350 event for only $300. This offer applies to each league you sign up for so if you sign up for multiple leagues, you'll receive $50 off each of your leagues. But you MUST SIGN UP NOW!!
Now in its second exciting season, the NFFC's Online Championship features the HIGHEST payouts in the fantasy industry with $2,100 in league prizes as well as an overall prize of $50,000. First place in each league wins $1,400, with second place earning $700 and both teams advance to the three-week Championship Round where one owner will take home the $50,000 grand prize. Sign up now and then contact Greg Ambrosius at [email protected] to receive the discount.
This SPECIAL OFFER won't last long so take advantage TODAY by signing up at nffc.fanball.com.
But that's not all we're offering today. If you're interested in signing up for any of our Live Events we have them at eight exciting locations this year. They include:
Las Vegas - Bellagio Hotel & Casino
New York - Citi Field
Chicago - Trackside Arlington Park
Boston - Radisson Hotel
Denver - Denver Marriott
Dallas - House of Blues
Buffalo - Seneca Casino
Minneapolis - Minneapolis Hilton
Here's the special FFOC offer through July 21 if you sign up and pay now:
The NFFC Classic - No Events Fee or co-manager fee, a savings of up to $100. The NFFC Classic features a $1,400 entry fee, a league prize of $5,000 and an overall prize of $100,000. NFFC Classic drafts are 14-team leagues with drafts being held on Saturday, Sept. 4.
The NFFC Primetime - No Events Fee or co-manager fee, a savings of up to $100. The NFFC Primetime features an $850 entry fee, a $3,000 league prize and an overall prize of $50,000. These are 12-team leagues with drafts also being held on Saturday, Sept. 4.
The NFFC Auction Championship - featuring an $850 entry fee and an overall prize of $10,000. The Auction Championship will only be held on Friday, Sept. 3 in Las Vegas, New York and Chicago.
The NFFC Draft Champions Championship - featuring an $850 entry fee and an overall prize of $10,000. This draft-only event will be held on Friday Sept. 3 in Las Vegas, New York, Chicago and Boston.
Sign up for any two live events by July 21 and you'll receive the discounts plus an autographed Rich Gannon mini-helmet. The first 25 owners to take advantage of this double-deal will get the mini-helmet of the former NFL MVP.
The NFFC also has affordable private satellite leagues with paybacks of 82% within each league, paying the top three finishers. Entry fees are $125, $250 and $500 per team and they are 14-team leagues with online drafts in July, August and September.
To sign up for any of these events go to nffc.fanball.com and then contact [email protected] for the giveaways and discounts. Good luck and welcome back.
[ July 17, 2010, 04:08 PM: Message edited by: Guinness Stingers ]
RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
Guys --
I am going to keep this brief.
Last year I played in FFPC and WCOFF along with Greg and Giselle. I attended the FFPC pre-party with Greg and it was a great event.
Greg and I were planning on returning, but man has that changed.
I can't stomach what Alex and David continue to do to all the other companies in the space. When Greg and I meet, we discuss how we can make this better and what we can do to make it the best event out there. My job is to ensure the product is the best and that's it meets our expectations from a monetary standpoint.
Therefore, I've stayed away - not because I'm hiding or don't want to discuss this stuff, I just find the accusations sickening and completely without merit.
It's obvious to me -- people will do whatever they can to tear you down in order to make their business better. I guess I should have known this, but because we have a fairly good relationship with Dustin and Jesse - I assumed we could have the same with Dave, Alex and now Joe and David D.
I've met with all of these guys and I think they all have a great passion for the high stakes space. I believe I've stated my concerns and I've discussed business with all of them. We don't always agree -- but that's ok.
However, I can't believe the depth of hatred and misguided information that keeps spewing out of Alex and Dave's mouth. Mix in their "followers of discredit" and we have a full-fledged movement to disrupt our contest.
And they didn't stop there.
They then raise serious concerns about RTS software platform and the WCOFF "cheating scandal" -- then jump to the same back end and sign up for the WCOFF contest. All the while, dogging them and telling everyone how stupid they are for signing up for their event.
This has been so wild to watch.
Now we have the FFOC scandal.
Each time I feel we've crossed one hurdle -- we get thrown another curve ball.
For the record, I'm not at liberty to speak about a lot of this but let me do my best.
I think we've proven we have no ownership - so I'll leave that for what it is. FFOC legal group stated this in their shutdown notice and have handled every aspect of paying off all customers who chose entries over $. We discussed this -- provided them a list of all customers who did this and everyone who is due money - to the best of my knowledge has been paid by the legal group overlooking the contest.
For those who got free entries, we tried to get them to come back, honor the entries and try to get the business on track. I think the contest was great, payouts were crazy - but in the end, they decided they could no longer do business and be successful.
Now we have more questions -- so let me do my best to try and get you some answers to these questions that have been raised by David Dodds:
1. What were the terms of settlement between FFOC and Fanball/CDM? Did Fanball buy their assets (or trade liabilities from the FFOC contest) to acquire the software, emails, etc?
Assets? Well -- let's think about this. We wrote a code set for FFOC and we had a marketing agreement. If you do an analysis on the FFOC database of users you would know that 81% of those customers came from Fanball database. In every agreement we make with white label partners, some of them being the biggest companies in the world (EA Sports, Dish Network, etc) we always co-own the customer database. There is a variety of reasons for this and we certainly did that in this situation. We also LICENSE the code to them -- they never OWN it.
So to answer your question: No -- we didn't "acquire" anything. We already owned it.
2. If the answer is no to question 1, what gives the "back-end provider" the right to use the software, the trademark and the email list?
We haven't used the software (yet) and we were never told about the trademark that FFOC apparently filled. I've already given you an answer about the email list so nuff said.
Furthermore, we were never told about the FFOC trademark and we completely dismissed it after they decided to shut down operations. It had no bearing in our decision to not offer the Cutline Championship. That really came down to timing. Also -- we didn't want to do something that would create confusion for our Online Championship. It's been quite successful and we are excited about the results of making this decision.
3. If the answer is yes, Isn't this unethical that Fanball was allowed to purchase all of the assets without taking on any of the liabilities?
Again, keep making false accusations! We didn't PURCHASE anything -- I love how you guys keep telling people stuff that's not true. Is it "unethical" to market to a database we own -- not that I'm aware of.
You really didn't think we'd offer a Cutline Championship on the FFOC platform if we didn't have access to the customers and code set -- did you?
4. When the decision was made (and the letters sent out by Fanball) to offer $310 worth of free teams next year instead of $185 cash, was a contest planned for 2010? What new costs emerged later that changed this view? I am pretty certain both Fanball and FFOC knew how much this contest lost when those letter were mailed out (Signups ended in September, and the costs were always known).
Wow -- another crazy one. So now you are insinuating that we knew they were shutting down. Completely false. There were not costs that emerged. Now that you are in the high stakes market -- I bet you can do the math on last years FFOC contest and get a sense of how much money they lost. I think that is pretty clear. Through all of that, they tried to make it work -- stuck it out and did everything the best way they could. Yes, they didn't give everyone their free entry, but they gave everyone the money they won and and I think that is a lot better then what some of the other contests have done. Still not ideal, but the money has been paid and they could have just BK'ed the business and told everyone sorry -- just ask Fantasy Jungle and AFFL. They didn't -- hired a legal group to handle the final payouts and to the best of my knowledge, they are still handling those payments. We've gotten a lot of feedback on guys thanking Fanball for facilitating this, but we really had nothing to do with it -- we just encouraged FFOC to make sure we handled this the right way. Again, not the best way and still a black eye on our business, but it could have been far worse.
Those questions aren't enough. You guys continue to throw out even MORE accusations.
I heard another one -- that the $1M prize had not been paid. Well that's insane. I think the guy just signed up for our Online Championship. Pretty sure if he had been "scorned" he wouldn't be back to play in another contest. Not to mention -- we probably would have heard about a lawsuit by now. Just to be clear -- all I've been told is positive about the $1M prize but I have no proof that is has or has not been paid.
So let me leave it at this --
Don't play in a contest where people throw out accusations to try and grow their own contests. If you have to resort to that level of "name calling" and deceit -- you should really question the business as a whole.
You'll see me and Greg at WCOFF -- but you will NOT see me playing anything endorsed by David or Alex!
David Dodds -- well I hope I answered your questions.
Joe Bryant -- Rarely has this business seen someone as professional as you. Through all of this -- we've both been professional to one another and I have nothing but great things to say about you. Keep up the great work and build the best fantasy football information site and boat company in the universe. Mix in a world-class BBQ company -- your entrepreneurial spirit is what I appreciate most about you.
To the rest of you -- as King of Queen stated "The tarring and feathering will continue" but do your best to overlook that garbage and get ready for football season! This one is going to be fun and NFFC is dedicated to ensuring that we focus on making our event and online game enjoyable.
I'll let the others worry about tearing our walls down.
“War is a poor chisel to carve out tomorrow.”
RH
I am going to keep this brief.
Last year I played in FFPC and WCOFF along with Greg and Giselle. I attended the FFPC pre-party with Greg and it was a great event.
Greg and I were planning on returning, but man has that changed.
I can't stomach what Alex and David continue to do to all the other companies in the space. When Greg and I meet, we discuss how we can make this better and what we can do to make it the best event out there. My job is to ensure the product is the best and that's it meets our expectations from a monetary standpoint.
Therefore, I've stayed away - not because I'm hiding or don't want to discuss this stuff, I just find the accusations sickening and completely without merit.
It's obvious to me -- people will do whatever they can to tear you down in order to make their business better. I guess I should have known this, but because we have a fairly good relationship with Dustin and Jesse - I assumed we could have the same with Dave, Alex and now Joe and David D.
I've met with all of these guys and I think they all have a great passion for the high stakes space. I believe I've stated my concerns and I've discussed business with all of them. We don't always agree -- but that's ok.
However, I can't believe the depth of hatred and misguided information that keeps spewing out of Alex and Dave's mouth. Mix in their "followers of discredit" and we have a full-fledged movement to disrupt our contest.
And they didn't stop there.
They then raise serious concerns about RTS software platform and the WCOFF "cheating scandal" -- then jump to the same back end and sign up for the WCOFF contest. All the while, dogging them and telling everyone how stupid they are for signing up for their event.
This has been so wild to watch.
Now we have the FFOC scandal.
Each time I feel we've crossed one hurdle -- we get thrown another curve ball.
For the record, I'm not at liberty to speak about a lot of this but let me do my best.
I think we've proven we have no ownership - so I'll leave that for what it is. FFOC legal group stated this in their shutdown notice and have handled every aspect of paying off all customers who chose entries over $. We discussed this -- provided them a list of all customers who did this and everyone who is due money - to the best of my knowledge has been paid by the legal group overlooking the contest.
For those who got free entries, we tried to get them to come back, honor the entries and try to get the business on track. I think the contest was great, payouts were crazy - but in the end, they decided they could no longer do business and be successful.
Now we have more questions -- so let me do my best to try and get you some answers to these questions that have been raised by David Dodds:
1. What were the terms of settlement between FFOC and Fanball/CDM? Did Fanball buy their assets (or trade liabilities from the FFOC contest) to acquire the software, emails, etc?
Assets? Well -- let's think about this. We wrote a code set for FFOC and we had a marketing agreement. If you do an analysis on the FFOC database of users you would know that 81% of those customers came from Fanball database. In every agreement we make with white label partners, some of them being the biggest companies in the world (EA Sports, Dish Network, etc) we always co-own the customer database. There is a variety of reasons for this and we certainly did that in this situation. We also LICENSE the code to them -- they never OWN it.
So to answer your question: No -- we didn't "acquire" anything. We already owned it.
2. If the answer is no to question 1, what gives the "back-end provider" the right to use the software, the trademark and the email list?
We haven't used the software (yet) and we were never told about the trademark that FFOC apparently filled. I've already given you an answer about the email list so nuff said.
Furthermore, we were never told about the FFOC trademark and we completely dismissed it after they decided to shut down operations. It had no bearing in our decision to not offer the Cutline Championship. That really came down to timing. Also -- we didn't want to do something that would create confusion for our Online Championship. It's been quite successful and we are excited about the results of making this decision.
3. If the answer is yes, Isn't this unethical that Fanball was allowed to purchase all of the assets without taking on any of the liabilities?
Again, keep making false accusations! We didn't PURCHASE anything -- I love how you guys keep telling people stuff that's not true. Is it "unethical" to market to a database we own -- not that I'm aware of.
You really didn't think we'd offer a Cutline Championship on the FFOC platform if we didn't have access to the customers and code set -- did you?
4. When the decision was made (and the letters sent out by Fanball) to offer $310 worth of free teams next year instead of $185 cash, was a contest planned for 2010? What new costs emerged later that changed this view? I am pretty certain both Fanball and FFOC knew how much this contest lost when those letter were mailed out (Signups ended in September, and the costs were always known).
Wow -- another crazy one. So now you are insinuating that we knew they were shutting down. Completely false. There were not costs that emerged. Now that you are in the high stakes market -- I bet you can do the math on last years FFOC contest and get a sense of how much money they lost. I think that is pretty clear. Through all of that, they tried to make it work -- stuck it out and did everything the best way they could. Yes, they didn't give everyone their free entry, but they gave everyone the money they won and and I think that is a lot better then what some of the other contests have done. Still not ideal, but the money has been paid and they could have just BK'ed the business and told everyone sorry -- just ask Fantasy Jungle and AFFL. They didn't -- hired a legal group to handle the final payouts and to the best of my knowledge, they are still handling those payments. We've gotten a lot of feedback on guys thanking Fanball for facilitating this, but we really had nothing to do with it -- we just encouraged FFOC to make sure we handled this the right way. Again, not the best way and still a black eye on our business, but it could have been far worse.
Those questions aren't enough. You guys continue to throw out even MORE accusations.
I heard another one -- that the $1M prize had not been paid. Well that's insane. I think the guy just signed up for our Online Championship. Pretty sure if he had been "scorned" he wouldn't be back to play in another contest. Not to mention -- we probably would have heard about a lawsuit by now. Just to be clear -- all I've been told is positive about the $1M prize but I have no proof that is has or has not been paid.
So let me leave it at this --
Don't play in a contest where people throw out accusations to try and grow their own contests. If you have to resort to that level of "name calling" and deceit -- you should really question the business as a whole.
You'll see me and Greg at WCOFF -- but you will NOT see me playing anything endorsed by David or Alex!
David Dodds -- well I hope I answered your questions.
Joe Bryant -- Rarely has this business seen someone as professional as you. Through all of this -- we've both been professional to one another and I have nothing but great things to say about you. Keep up the great work and build the best fantasy football information site and boat company in the universe. Mix in a world-class BBQ company -- your entrepreneurial spirit is what I appreciate most about you.
To the rest of you -- as King of Queen stated "The tarring and feathering will continue" but do your best to overlook that garbage and get ready for football season! This one is going to be fun and NFFC is dedicated to ensuring that we focus on making our event and online game enjoyable.
I'll let the others worry about tearing our walls down.
“War is a poor chisel to carve out tomorrow.”
RH
RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
Originally posted by King of Queens:
As a wise man once said: "Serious accusations require serious evidence." To date, I have yet to see a smoking gun.
Scott's FPA has the potential to be an excellent advocate for high stakes fantasy football players. Unfortunately, by presenting these allegations as a witch hunt, he is firing some people up while alienating others. Perhaps a less sensational tone is in order. I agree 100% Glenn.
As a wise man once said: "Serious accusations require serious evidence." To date, I have yet to see a smoking gun.
Scott's FPA has the potential to be an excellent advocate for high stakes fantasy football players. Unfortunately, by presenting these allegations as a witch hunt, he is firing some people up while alienating others. Perhaps a less sensational tone is in order. I agree 100% Glenn.
Bauler Shot Caller
RvB - SPANS THE GLOBE tonight!
Being new to all of this, can someone please translate all of this to me. The readers digest version please.......
Joe