Looking For Quick Feedback On NFFC Cutline Rule

[Greg Ambrosius]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. I think everyone made great points and it's time to move forward.

We'll keep the NFFC Cutline Championship as is with owners setting Starting Lineups each week. I understand how an optimal scoring lineup would change roster construction in a 10-team league and with only 26 roster spots that could be tough. Changing to Team Kickers in this format would help. Too many other good ideas to just throw this together in one week, so let's keep things as they are and grow this contest as is.

We'll kick off the Cutline season next week with the first scheduled drafts of the season. We have one set for Sunday, but with NFBC FAAB in the way let's do it right by kicking it off next Wednesday. Let's fill that one up and talk about the results on our STATS Fantasy Advantage show. Heck, maybe we'll even have an owner on to discuss what happened in the draft.

Here's the first draft dates for the 2016 NFFC Cutline Championship:

8 PM ET, Wednesday, May 25, 2016
8 PM ET, Friday, May 27, 2016
9 PM ET, Monday, May 30, 2016
8 PM ET, Friday, June 3, 2016

And if you see certain dates and times that you want added just let us know. We can do it. We had a lot of success last year with 9 pm ET and 10 pm ET Cutlines and you may see plenty of those in July, August and September. Thanks all and let's get rolling.

Okay, who's ready to jump in on the first Cutline of the season and KICK BUTT?!! Here we go.

[morons]

-I don't think it is a good idea to changes the rules of a game in mid-May, just a few months before the season starts. There would be many people who draft their team in the next few weeks and are not aware there was a change in the rules and then you'd have disgruntled players.

-However, I do think it is worth looking at for 2017, however. As Greg pointed out at the start of the thread, we need to grow the game and keep it fun. To say "don't change anything" isn't accomplishing that.

-If I compare the two games, the Cutline is clearly inferior to the Draft Champions. Why? Because it requires more work to manage the team (weekly lineup changes and several FAAB compared to the DC which require neither) and it offers a lower payout and return on investment. Unless you are one of the 2 teams that finishes first or second overall in the Cutline and win the $75000 grand prize or $35000 second place prize, you would have been better off putting your money in a Draft Champions team instead. Take that one step further, only 22 total teams in the Cutline will win more than $800 prize each league champ in a Draft Champions league will win. So 1 in 100 teams (22 of 2200, or 1%)in the Cutline will win more than $800, whereas 1 in 12 in the Draft Champions will win $800 minimum (maybe more, I'm not even including DC overall prizes in my argument). Also, considering that second place in a Draft Champions league wins $300, so then 1 in 6 DC teams doubles their money or better where as only 1 in 10 in the Cutline will double their money.

-So, as I've illustrated: the Cutline is inferior to Draft Champions because of lower odds of winning, lower payout and return on investment(unless you are one of two lucky lottery winners), and more effort involved to manage the team. This is what needs to be changed if the Cutline is expected to grow.

-Obviously, I am in favor of an optimal lineup/best ball format for the Cutline. I don't think it makes it the same as a Draft Champions because:
-Cutline has FAAB, DC doesn't
-Cutline is 10 teams, DC is 12 or 14
-Cutline has a head-to-head component, DC does not
-Cutline does not have KDS or 3rd round reversal, DC does

I still think it would be two different games that had best ball scoring in common but other differences.

-I would be in favor of a quota of 3 kickers and defenses max per team to avoid the scenario others mentioned of teams hoarding K and D.

-I disagree with the injury theory. I think a best ball lineup helps you offset a scenario where a guy like LeVeon Bell or Jamal Charles leaves a game early with a injury or someone is a last-minute DNP because it would ideally allow you to replace a zero or low score with a better performance. In a 9-week season, a few empty scores can keep you out of the playoff group.

-Maybe a compromise would be a best-ball regular season but you had to set your lineups in the post-season?

-It's too late to change for this year, but it should be considered for more than a day and a half prior to next year. As others said, I also want to cut back on the work I spend managing teams this year. I want either the high pay-out leagues in Vegas or the no-effort best ball leagues. I won't be able to do nearly as many Cutlines this year if I get stuck managing them all. Once other "draftaholics" realize that same thing, I'm afraid enrollment will drop.

Just my 20 cents.

MATT

[Greg Ambrosius]

All good points Matt. I think the idea of allowing optimal scoring lineups during the season and then having owners set their starting lineups in Weeks 10-16 is interesting. I did discuss that with IT and that would definitely take some work, but yes that could be an interesting change and spur some growth.

My thought is that the Cutline is a lottery ticket: $125 for a shot at winning $75,000 while learning the player pool during quick, easy drafts. I love the fact that these take two hours or less and the FAAB time is reduced. But as we all know, it still takes a lot of time and effort to get the right 10 in your starting lineup each week. Not a game ender, but for a lottery ticket it's extra work.

We'll see if we can promote this contest better to grow the numbers to the level we are expecting. Prizes are based on 2,600+ teams and last year we finished with just under 2,200 teams. The ROI the last two years has been in the consumer's favor, so it's been a good lottery ticket for players. This year we either grow the numbers with the current format or we bring the grand prize down to a level that supports 2,000-2,200 teams. Easy enough.

The third option, which I was proposing here, was a slight rules change to make the contest more in line with a lottery ticket. But maybe for a 10-team format that doesn't work. We'll keep discussing and have some fun with the ideas while we're competing in the current format. I like that.

Thanks for the feedback everyone and let's have a great drafting season.

[kjduke]

It is incomprehensible to me that people are complaining the cutline change would make the contest too much like DC Leagues when it would have only ONE thing in common with DCs. How similar are the 12 and 14 team overalls? Do those same players think we should dump one of those because they're too similar? The Classic and Prime are identical except for 2 more teams in the league and thus a slightly shallower player pool ...

... yet people couldn't wrap their heads around a second optimal format that is different from DCs by having 1) a very shallow vs very deep player pool and roster, 2) h2h vs total points, 3) a playoff system, 4) faab vs no faab, 5) KDS/3rr vs no KDS/3rr, 6) slow draft vs quick draft, 7) a game that might appeal to more novice players that are drafting mainly in the few weeks before the season vs one that appeals to hardcore drafters that are picking teams in May. I don't get it, other than people post before they think ... seems like you let about 7 of those people lead you to a decision that hurts the long-term growth of the contest. Hopefully with more time to discuss for 2017 there can be a more thoughtful discussion and a better decision.

There is a definite need for an optimal-scoring contest other than the DC format.

[southpaw24]

It is incomprehensible to me that people are complaining the cutline change would make the contest too much like DC Leagues when it would have only ONE thing in common with DCs. How similar are the 12 and 14 team overalls? Do those same players think we should dump one of those because they're too similar? The Classic and Prime are identical except for 2 more teams in the league and thus a slightly shallower player pool ...

... yet people couldn't wrap their heads around a second optimal format that is different from DCs by having 1) a very shallow vs very deep player pool and roster, 2) h2h vs total points, 3) a playoff system, 4) faab vs no faab, 5) KDS/3rr vs no KDS/3rr, 6) slow draft vs quick draft, 7) a game that might appeal to more novice players that are drafting mainly in the few weeks before the season vs one that appeals to hardcore drafters that are picking teams in May. I don't get it, other than people post before they think ... seems like you let about 7 of those people lead you to a decision that hurts the long-term growth of the contest. Hopefully with more time to discuss for 2017 there can be a more thoughtful discussion and a better decision.

There is a definite need for an optimal-scoring contest other than the DC format.

Agree 100%.

[ulbkumn]

The love the DC format. I hope this is a new rule next year.

[CALI CARTEL]

I would definitely prefer and play more Cutlines if they were Optimal Lineups. But I do like the suggestion to change to lineup setting in the Playoff Rounds.

[Greg Ambrosius]

There is a definite need for an optimal-scoring contest other than the DC format.

I think there is too and maybe we just need another year to figure out if the Cutline should be that contest or not. I do think that these would sell out every night from June through September with an easier in-season format because people love to draft and buy the lottery ticket that turns $125 into $75,000 or more. I think with an easier in-season format we could get this contest to a $100,000 grand prize again.

But rushing it doesn't make sense right now. I hope we still get strong support for this contest and grow it. Then next year we can think about slightly altering this format. The idea of a DC during the regular season and a set lineup during the all-important playoffs would be VERY intriguing if we could design it that way. The idea of changing to a team kicker to avoid expanding the rosters too far would be interesting if we could program that. There were some ideas that could make this more appealing and more interesting and so vetting all of those ideas makes sense. Let's have another good Cutline season as is and filter some of these ideas out to form an even better contest with growth potential for 2017.