Silver Bullet payout......revolutionary???

[BillyWaz]

Hope everyone had a great Thanksgiving!

So I think most here would agree (maybe everybody?) that the goal of this game is to SCORE POINTS.

Is there any way we could do a survey on possibly changing the rules for the Primetime/Classic (Satellites, High Stake events, Auctions etc.) to the following;

1st place is total points
2nd is NEXT points
3rd place is record

In the classic and primetimes, there would be no reason to have a "3 week playoff", as the payouts could be the following for POINTS/2ND POINTS/RECORD;

CLASSIC 7500/3200/1600 (I realize there are different plans for the Classic next year, but you get the idea)
PRIMETIME 7000/3200/1000

In high stakes leagues, auctions, satellites, etc., you could pay 65% - 70% for BEST POINTS, and the remaining 30-35% to 2ND BEST POINTS (record would get in playoffs, as would next highest points).

EXAMPLE:

Super is currently $2500 for record and $2500 for points. How about $3500/$1500 for points and 2nd points?
Ultimate is currently $5000 for record and $5000 for points. How about $7000/$3000 for points and 2nd points?
Diamond is currently $10000 for record and $10000 for points. How about $14000/$6000 for points and 2nd points?

And yes, I realize you couldn't "sweep", but if a team finished 9-4 and 5 points behind the points leader, because some team who has 200 less points got lucky going 10-3, that just doesn't seem right.

With so much "luck" involved in H2H (and I do have a few teams that have benefitted from this, this year), it has really hurt many QUALITY teams because someone not deserving is taking guaranteed money away.

Just something to maybe discuss.......

[Darik B]

Noted.

[BLACKHAND]

We have been talking about this for years. My personal opinion is that it is time to make this change. Another change would be to eliminate most of these consolation prizes and pay the 4th playoff team the money. If you make the playoffs and your team gets decimated by injury and you end up in 4th place you should still get some playoff money and not have a team that finished 7th or 8th get money while you do not get anything. We do this in the New York super and I think it's very fair.

[King of Queens]

Why have H2H at all? Seriously.

[chriseibl]

I love anything that makes points more important than record but the above proposal needs to be tweaked or clarified. The huge problem with the above proposal as written is that it actually makes H2H much more likely to cause an undeserving team to make the championship round, which I don't think is what you're trying to accomplish.

The reason for this is that is that right now, the "#1 seed" goes to record, and it's more likely than not that the best record is one of the three highest scoring teams in the league. If you were to instead make the "#3 seed" based on record after the first two seeds are awarded based on points, it then becomes very unlikely that the team getting in the championship round based on record is one of the three highest scoring teams in the league. The end result is that you've drastically reduced the likelihood that the team getting in on record is one of the top 3 scoring teams in the league.

I do like the idea of shifting payouts to points over record. The ideal tweak would be the that #1 seed is still awarded based on record, but payouts go to the top 3 teams based solely on order of points scored. Or forget H2H entirely.

[Greg Ambrosius]

I agree Chris, this is NOT revolutionary for the industry. Right now we have 70 NFFC Classic and Primetime teams and 90% (63 of 70) have the h2h leader in the Top 3 in points. Only seven of 70 teams are currently leading in h2h yet fourth or lower in their league points total. When the third seed is the best remaining h2h champion I'm not sure we'll get a Top 3 leader in points as often as we do now in the Classic and Primetime. I might be wrong, but we'll analyze the Silver Bullet playoff finalists to see if this is correct or not. Maybe I'll be proven wrong here.

The goal of the die-hards in the NFFC is to take EVERY aspect of luck out of the equation, which results in a total points league where all you watch each week is total points. I understand that and appreciate that. But Is that a system that will GROW the contest? Will it bring in new customers who are used to h2h in fantasy football? Is that what other national contests offer? Or is it something that would appeal to only our die-hards?

There are other formats that grow BECAUSE luck is a big proponent of winning a league title, where h2h is used in league playoffs and the regular season is only 11 weeks!! As a game operator, we need to continue to induce new players to try our format and a season-long, total points contest just doesn't seem like a growing format. I think we have one of the fairest playoff qualifying systems out there and yet there's always room for improvement. Getting rid of h2h and going total points for 13 weeks doesn't seem like the answer to me and we'll see if h2h as the third seed produces better results as well. The Silver Bullet will tell us.

What we've always tried to do is to get the three best teams from each league into the playoffs, and if a fourth team is worthy to give them an outlet to qualify as well. But h2h is so ingrained into season-long fantasy football that to get rid of it -- I believe, and I may be wrong -- wouldn't help the NFFC grow. Again, just my two cents.

Yes, h2h invites some form of luck and allows some "lucky" owners to qualify for the playoffs. But it also keeps more owners involved in setting their starting lineups for 13 weeks and keeps more teams involved in securing a playoff spot. You will never replace lucky entirely, and in some ways that's not a bad thing. Again, just my two cents.

[Coltsfan]

Luck is a very good thing. It seems like people always forget that it does work both ways. The more teams that have a chance of winning, the better the chances are of them returning to play again. Have you seen how many teams aren't even bothering to set line ups? They quit because there is no way to make up the points whereas if they are still in it due to head to head then they are at least competitive and walk away feeling good.

The other thing is that the team with the most points isn't always the best team. Some teams have huge WW pickups during the season and become monster teams at the end of the year. I've been odd man out many times in these leagues but I've always taken down a couple where I wasn't the best team. Over time it evens out. I just think the experience for people playing is more positive with h2h.


Wayne

[BONGIZMO]

I was actually going to post for the exact opposite reason of what Billy requested as the record being third is in fact causing an issue in my Silver Bullet League. Top scoring team will finish with tie at best record HOWEVER he gets in on points, second gets in on points and the third will be a team fifth in points who will now find their way in.

As noted by an earlier poster, the majority of teams that have top record likely will be up towards the top in points over 13 weeks unless someone caught a glitch in the matrix whereas everything broke their way.

Please don’t make any other leagues set up like this, in fact I’d prefer the SB be as all the other events. It wasn’t until a couple weeks ago I even noticed we had this change in the SB from the other events. All this attempt to eliminate luck could get us like the NFL with their desire to make the games officiated perfectly. The end result might not be as desired as one way think.

Scott

[Money]

I was actually going to post for the exact opposite reason of what Billy requested as the record being third is in fact causing an issue in my Silver Bullet League. Top scoring team will finish with tie at best record HOWEVER he gets in on points, second gets in on points and the third will be a team fifth in points who will now find their way in.

As noted by an earlier poster, the majority of teams that have top record likely will be up towards the top in points over 13 weeks unless someone caught a glitch in the matrix whereas everything broke their way.

Please don’t make any other leagues set up like this, in fact I’d prefer the SB be as all the other events. It wasn’t until a couple weeks ago I even noticed we had this change in the SB from the other events. All this attempt to eliminate luck could get us like the NFL with their desire to make the games officiated perfectly. The end result might not be as desired as one way think.

Scott

This setup rewards the top points teams the league prize money which at first may seem fine. It is an abomination to the third place point team who will get left out because of this ridiculous change for this format. I'm in third 138 points ahead of a team that will qualify.

I have a respectable team that could compete for the overall championship in a very limited field. I don't understand why the change. What a shame as I suppose there will be multiple situations like this.

[Money]

I was actually going to post for the exact opposite reason of what Billy requested as the record being third is in fact causing an issue in my Silver Bullet League. Top scoring team will finish with tie at best record HOWEVER he gets in on points, second gets in on points and the third will be a team fifth in points who will now find their way in.

As noted by an earlier poster, the majority of teams that have top record likely will be up towards the top in points over 13 weeks unless someone caught a glitch in the matrix whereas everything broke their way.

Please don’t make any other leagues set up like this, in fact I’d prefer the SB be as all the other events. It wasn’t until a couple weeks ago I even noticed we had this change in the SB from the other events. All this attempt to eliminate luck could get us like the NFL with their desire to make the games officiated perfectly. The end result might not be as desired as one way think.

Scott

This setup rewards the top points teams the league prize money which at first may seem fine. It is an abomination to the third place point team who will get left out because of this ridiculous change for this format. I'm in third 138 points ahead of a team that will qualify.

I have a respectable team that could compete for the overall championship in a very limited field. I don't understand why the change. What a shame as I suppose there will be multiple situations like this.

To take it one step further the qualifying team will finish somewhere around 90th overall out of 180 teams. They may not even be in the top half of the competition.