Originally posted by Samlawyer:
Even in the Primetime league, it just seems like the number of teams that advance is too limited. We are in Week 7 and 6 teams (including me) out of 12 are completely out of it. Completely. For full disclosure, I'm referring to Primetime Chicago - League 2. The waiver wire is completely drained (even defenses!), and it's tough to get motivated to put a lineup in, much less maneuver to improve my team.
I've been doing the high stakes fantasy thing for several years now, so I'm no rookie to this, but it's been awhile since I've felt such malaise so early. Perhaps it's just one of those years. Perhaps the playoff structure needs revisiting. I don't know. If I can't overcome a flawed draft and be competitive (which simply was not possible this year), I'll have to think long and hard about returning. Pushing "all-in" on draft day may be too big a gamble under the current structure.
Sorry for being a downer, but like I said, maybe it's just me . . . I wonder if others agree or disagree. Years like this do happen, and it always sucks when they come along. I will tell you this, I've been and I'm currently down 100+ points midway through a few different years. And because of the 13 week season it's given me plenty of time to climb back in to the race and win/come in second here. Which is the cool thing about the 13 weeks.
I will say this, your post gives me an excellent opportunity to say that moving to 19 rounds was a VERY bad idea. The WW IS drained, the moves to make ARE VERY (Caps, emphasis..) limited that can be made. That extra round has removed the 14 players from the pool that would otherwise be available as marginal or upside plays.
I'd like to see that go back. 266 players is just a little too much IMO.
Hang tough, keep setting a lineup and maybe a 200 point week is in the cards SamLaywer.
3'
Oh, and I wouldn't add more teams to playoff round, can't support that one.
[ October 29, 2009, 06:48 AM: Message edited by: 3intboyBFD ]
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
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Greg Ambrosius
- Posts: 35878
- Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2004 6:00 pm
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
Originally posted by 3intboyBFD:
quote:Originally posted by Samlawyer:
Even in the Primetime league, it just seems like the number of teams that advance is too limited. We are in Week 7 and 6 teams (including me) out of 12 are completely out of it. Completely. For full disclosure, I'm referring to Primetime Chicago - League 2. The waiver wire is completely drained (even defenses!), and it's tough to get motivated to put a lineup in, much less maneuver to improve my team.
I've been doing the high stakes fantasy thing for several years now, so I'm no rookie to this, but it's been awhile since I've felt such malaise so early. Perhaps it's just one of those years. Perhaps the playoff structure needs revisiting. I don't know. If I can't overcome a flawed draft and be competitive (which simply was not possible this year), I'll have to think long and hard about returning. Pushing "all-in" on draft day may be too big a gamble under the current structure.
Sorry for being a downer, but like I said, maybe it's just me . . . I wonder if others agree or disagree. Years like this do happen, and it always sucks when they come along. I will tell you this, I've been and I'm currently down 100+ points midway through a few different years. And because of the 13 week season it's given me plenty of time to climb back in to the race and win/come in second here. Which is the cool thing about the 13 weeks.
I will say this, your post gives me an excellent opportunity to say that moving to 19 rounds was a VERY bad idea. The WW IS drained, the moves to make ARE VERY (Caps, emphasis..) limited that can be made. That extra round has removed the 14 players from the pool that would otherwise be available as marginal or upside plays.
I'd like to see that go back. 266 players is just a little too much IMO.
Hang tough, keep setting a lineup and maybe a 200 point week is in the cards SamLaywer.
3'
Oh, and I wouldn't add more teams to playoff round, can't support that one. [/QUOTE]Just a clarification: Sam is only in the NFFC Primetime, which still has 20 rounds and only 240 players gone from the player pool. So he thinks it's thin with 240 players. As Lou said, you should see how thin it is in the NFFC Classic with 266 players gone.
We're all in a lot of leagues where the free agent pool is thin right now. It seems to be one of those years, yet there are still the Miles Austin's and Shonn Greene's popping up at times. It's a crazy year.
quote:Originally posted by Samlawyer:
Even in the Primetime league, it just seems like the number of teams that advance is too limited. We are in Week 7 and 6 teams (including me) out of 12 are completely out of it. Completely. For full disclosure, I'm referring to Primetime Chicago - League 2. The waiver wire is completely drained (even defenses!), and it's tough to get motivated to put a lineup in, much less maneuver to improve my team.
I've been doing the high stakes fantasy thing for several years now, so I'm no rookie to this, but it's been awhile since I've felt such malaise so early. Perhaps it's just one of those years. Perhaps the playoff structure needs revisiting. I don't know. If I can't overcome a flawed draft and be competitive (which simply was not possible this year), I'll have to think long and hard about returning. Pushing "all-in" on draft day may be too big a gamble under the current structure.
Sorry for being a downer, but like I said, maybe it's just me . . . I wonder if others agree or disagree. Years like this do happen, and it always sucks when they come along. I will tell you this, I've been and I'm currently down 100+ points midway through a few different years. And because of the 13 week season it's given me plenty of time to climb back in to the race and win/come in second here. Which is the cool thing about the 13 weeks.
I will say this, your post gives me an excellent opportunity to say that moving to 19 rounds was a VERY bad idea. The WW IS drained, the moves to make ARE VERY (Caps, emphasis..) limited that can be made. That extra round has removed the 14 players from the pool that would otherwise be available as marginal or upside plays.
I'd like to see that go back. 266 players is just a little too much IMO.
Hang tough, keep setting a lineup and maybe a 200 point week is in the cards SamLaywer.
3'
Oh, and I wouldn't add more teams to playoff round, can't support that one. [/QUOTE]Just a clarification: Sam is only in the NFFC Primetime, which still has 20 rounds and only 240 players gone from the player pool. So he thinks it's thin with 240 players. As Lou said, you should see how thin it is in the NFFC Classic with 266 players gone.
We're all in a lot of leagues where the free agent pool is thin right now. It seems to be one of those years, yet there are still the Miles Austin's and Shonn Greene's popping up at times. It's a crazy year.
Founder, National Fantasy Football Championship & National Fantasy Baseball Championship
Twitter: @GregAmbrosius
Twitter: @GregAmbrosius
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Henry Muto
- Posts: 222
- Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2009 6:00 pm
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
Have 4 playoff teams instead of 2. Give the top 2 teams in scoring in the league and advantage by giving them the difference in avg score for the year 140 to 130 so team 1 is +10 pts going into their playoff game.
This gives team more of a chance to stave off a bad draft, slow start, early injury or something.
Keep the overall structure the same still only have 2 teams from each league make the overall playoffs plus that 10%.
Have the team with the highest score in the regular season get an auto berth into the overall 14-16 weeks playoffs.
Give the Champion of the playoffs the other berth (if the same team then give the runner up the berth)
With the way the payouts are less than 50% of the league money going into league prizes (meaning even if you make the final 2 your normal rate 1 time every 6 years) you end up a big time loser over a 6 year stretch. You pay $6,000 or whatever it is over 6 years and end up winning back less than $3,000...then on top of that you pay taxes for your "winnings" which in the end is losings. Most of the money is put into the overall top prize which only 1 out of 300+ can win each year. So this is basically a lottery as far as trying to be a succesful winning player over the long haul. Any person can have a good year and come out ahead but do it for 6 years and 90% will be in the red.
Hard for contests to survive that because people will finally get sick of losing.
4 playoff teams would at least give you a better chance to think your season isn't a waste a few weeks in. I am in 1st place in pts in 1 of my leagues but thanks to bad luck I am only 4-3 and I feel like I must have a perfect week every week or 1 week will cost me the entire season. I really hate that feeling.
This gives team more of a chance to stave off a bad draft, slow start, early injury or something.
Keep the overall structure the same still only have 2 teams from each league make the overall playoffs plus that 10%.
Have the team with the highest score in the regular season get an auto berth into the overall 14-16 weeks playoffs.
Give the Champion of the playoffs the other berth (if the same team then give the runner up the berth)
With the way the payouts are less than 50% of the league money going into league prizes (meaning even if you make the final 2 your normal rate 1 time every 6 years) you end up a big time loser over a 6 year stretch. You pay $6,000 or whatever it is over 6 years and end up winning back less than $3,000...then on top of that you pay taxes for your "winnings" which in the end is losings. Most of the money is put into the overall top prize which only 1 out of 300+ can win each year. So this is basically a lottery as far as trying to be a succesful winning player over the long haul. Any person can have a good year and come out ahead but do it for 6 years and 90% will be in the red.
Hard for contests to survive that because people will finally get sick of losing.
4 playoff teams would at least give you a better chance to think your season isn't a waste a few weeks in. I am in 1st place in pts in 1 of my leagues but thanks to bad luck I am only 4-3 and I feel like I must have a perfect week every week or 1 week will cost me the entire season. I really hate that feeling.
2023 NFFC Cutline Champion and 4th place ($90,000) (1720 teams)
2014 RTS Fantasy Championship National Champion ($200,000) (2460 teams)
2012 NFFC Online National Champion and 4th place ($110,000 winner) (1872 teams)
2014 DFWC National Champion (288 teams)
2014 RTS Fantasy Championship National Champion ($200,000) (2460 teams)
2012 NFFC Online National Champion and 4th place ($110,000 winner) (1872 teams)
2014 DFWC National Champion (288 teams)
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
I LIKE ALOT OF WHAT YOU SAID HENRY. HOWEVER IF MORE MONEY IS PUT INTO LEAGUE PRIZES WOULD THAT AS WELL MAKE PEOPLE NOT RETURN?
THE LURE OF A BIG GRAND PRIZE CAUSES PEOPLE TO RETURN AS WELL.
THAT IS ONE OF THE MAIN COMPONENTS OF THE WCOFF. THE LURE OF THE 300,000 GRAND PRIZE KEEPS THEIR ENTRIES AT A FAIRLY HIGH NUMBER YEAR IN AND YEAR OUT.
MORE MONEY INTO LEAGUE PRIZES IN TURN LOWERS THAT GRAND PRIZE NUMBER. SO I GUESS IT IS ON EACH INDIVIDUAL.
THE LURE OF A BIG GRAND PRIZE CAUSES PEOPLE TO RETURN AS WELL.
THAT IS ONE OF THE MAIN COMPONENTS OF THE WCOFF. THE LURE OF THE 300,000 GRAND PRIZE KEEPS THEIR ENTRIES AT A FAIRLY HIGH NUMBER YEAR IN AND YEAR OUT.
MORE MONEY INTO LEAGUE PRIZES IN TURN LOWERS THAT GRAND PRIZE NUMBER. SO I GUESS IT IS ON EACH INDIVIDUAL.
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
Originally posted by 3intboyBFD:
quote:Originally posted by Samlawyer:
Even in the Primetime league, it just seems like the number of teams that advance is too limited. We are in Week 7 and 6 teams (including me) out of 12 are completely out of it. Completely. For full disclosure, I'm referring to Primetime Chicago - League 2. The waiver wire is completely drained (even defenses!), and it's tough to get motivated to put a lineup in, much less maneuver to improve my team.
I've been doing the high stakes fantasy thing for several years now, so I'm no rookie to this, but it's been awhile since I've felt such malaise so early. Perhaps it's just one of those years. Perhaps the playoff structure needs revisiting. I don't know. If I can't overcome a flawed draft and be competitive (which simply was not possible this year), I'll have to think long and hard about returning. Pushing "all-in" on draft day may be too big a gamble under the current structure.
Sorry for being a downer, but like I said, maybe it's just me . . . I wonder if others agree or disagree. I will say this, your post gives me an excellent opportunity to say that moving to 19 rounds was a VERY bad idea. The WW IS drained, the moves to make ARE VERY (Caps, emphasis..) limited that can be made. That extra round has removed the 14 players from the pool that would otherwise be available as marginal or upside plays.
[/QUOTE]C'mon Lou, this is HIGH STAKES Fantasy Football, not some 10 team Yahoo League!
The 14 team league is a CHALLENGE, if it was easy, it wouldn't be fun.
Just an FYI, the 12 teamers are also VERY depleted, because there are very few quality free agents available.
To say it is solely because of adding ONE roster spot is a stretch at best.
quote:Originally posted by Samlawyer:
Even in the Primetime league, it just seems like the number of teams that advance is too limited. We are in Week 7 and 6 teams (including me) out of 12 are completely out of it. Completely. For full disclosure, I'm referring to Primetime Chicago - League 2. The waiver wire is completely drained (even defenses!), and it's tough to get motivated to put a lineup in, much less maneuver to improve my team.
I've been doing the high stakes fantasy thing for several years now, so I'm no rookie to this, but it's been awhile since I've felt such malaise so early. Perhaps it's just one of those years. Perhaps the playoff structure needs revisiting. I don't know. If I can't overcome a flawed draft and be competitive (which simply was not possible this year), I'll have to think long and hard about returning. Pushing "all-in" on draft day may be too big a gamble under the current structure.
Sorry for being a downer, but like I said, maybe it's just me . . . I wonder if others agree or disagree. I will say this, your post gives me an excellent opportunity to say that moving to 19 rounds was a VERY bad idea. The WW IS drained, the moves to make ARE VERY (Caps, emphasis..) limited that can be made. That extra round has removed the 14 players from the pool that would otherwise be available as marginal or upside plays.
[/QUOTE]C'mon Lou, this is HIGH STAKES Fantasy Football, not some 10 team Yahoo League!
The 14 team league is a CHALLENGE, if it was easy, it wouldn't be fun.
Just an FYI, the 12 teamers are also VERY depleted, because there are very few quality free agents available.
To say it is solely because of adding ONE roster spot is a stretch at best.
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
Originally posted by BillyWaz:
quote:Originally posted by 3intboyBFD:
quote:Originally posted by Samlawyer:
Even in the Primetime league, it just seems like the number of teams that advance is too limited. We are in Week 7 and 6 teams (including me) out of 12 are completely out of it. Completely. For full disclosure, I'm referring to Primetime Chicago - League 2. The waiver wire is completely drained (even defenses!), and it's tough to get motivated to put a lineup in, much less maneuver to improve my team.
I've been doing the high stakes fantasy thing for several years now, so I'm no rookie to this, but it's been awhile since I've felt such malaise so early. Perhaps it's just one of those years. Perhaps the playoff structure needs revisiting. I don't know. If I can't overcome a flawed draft and be competitive (which simply was not possible this year), I'll have to think long and hard about returning. Pushing "all-in" on draft day may be too big a gamble under the current structure.
Sorry for being a downer, but like I said, maybe it's just me . . . I wonder if others agree or disagree. I will say this, your post gives me an excellent opportunity to say that moving to 19 rounds was a VERY bad idea. The WW IS drained, the moves to make ARE VERY (Caps, emphasis..) limited that can be made. That extra round has removed the 14 players from the pool that would otherwise be available as marginal or upside plays.
[/QUOTE]C'mon Lou, this is HIGH STAKES Fantasy Football, not some 10 team Yahoo League!
The 14 team league is a CHALLENGE, if it was easy, it wouldn't be fun.
Just an FYI, the 12 teamers are also VERY depleted, because there are very few quality free agents available.
To say it is solely because of adding ONE roster spot is a stretch at best. [/QUOTE]I'm Glad You answered this, I agree with You by the way.
quote:Originally posted by 3intboyBFD:
quote:Originally posted by Samlawyer:
Even in the Primetime league, it just seems like the number of teams that advance is too limited. We are in Week 7 and 6 teams (including me) out of 12 are completely out of it. Completely. For full disclosure, I'm referring to Primetime Chicago - League 2. The waiver wire is completely drained (even defenses!), and it's tough to get motivated to put a lineup in, much less maneuver to improve my team.
I've been doing the high stakes fantasy thing for several years now, so I'm no rookie to this, but it's been awhile since I've felt such malaise so early. Perhaps it's just one of those years. Perhaps the playoff structure needs revisiting. I don't know. If I can't overcome a flawed draft and be competitive (which simply was not possible this year), I'll have to think long and hard about returning. Pushing "all-in" on draft day may be too big a gamble under the current structure.
Sorry for being a downer, but like I said, maybe it's just me . . . I wonder if others agree or disagree. I will say this, your post gives me an excellent opportunity to say that moving to 19 rounds was a VERY bad idea. The WW IS drained, the moves to make ARE VERY (Caps, emphasis..) limited that can be made. That extra round has removed the 14 players from the pool that would otherwise be available as marginal or upside plays.
[/QUOTE]C'mon Lou, this is HIGH STAKES Fantasy Football, not some 10 team Yahoo League!
The 14 team league is a CHALLENGE, if it was easy, it wouldn't be fun.
Just an FYI, the 12 teamers are also VERY depleted, because there are very few quality free agents available.
To say it is solely because of adding ONE roster spot is a stretch at best. [/QUOTE]I'm Glad You answered this, I agree with You by the way.
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Glenneration X
- Posts: 1704
- Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:00 pm
- Location: Long Island, NY
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
Well, seems like I'm joining the minority in all the debate threads today...but here we go again.
I think the NFFC playoff system is too limited.
As I stated in the 18 vs. 19 roster spots thread, I've heard and understand the high stakes, high risk arguments.
Still, why does increasing the playoff participants or overall championship participants reduce the high stakes or high risk?
Is the NFFC more high stakes or high risk than the NFL itself? Yet they allow 12 teams or 38% of its teams into its playoffs. The NFFC allows only 17 or 21% dependent upon which contest.
Even MLB, the last major sport that expanded its playoffs and the most limited major sport when it comes to playoff participants allows 27%.
What was the reason MLB gave for expanding their playoffs? To keep more teams involved longer and to keep the interest of more of their paying customers longer.
The NFFC should keep the interest of more of their paying customers longer.
Glenn
I think the NFFC playoff system is too limited.
As I stated in the 18 vs. 19 roster spots thread, I've heard and understand the high stakes, high risk arguments.
Still, why does increasing the playoff participants or overall championship participants reduce the high stakes or high risk?
Is the NFFC more high stakes or high risk than the NFL itself? Yet they allow 12 teams or 38% of its teams into its playoffs. The NFFC allows only 17 or 21% dependent upon which contest.
Even MLB, the last major sport that expanded its playoffs and the most limited major sport when it comes to playoff participants allows 27%.
What was the reason MLB gave for expanding their playoffs? To keep more teams involved longer and to keep the interest of more of their paying customers longer.
The NFFC should keep the interest of more of their paying customers longer.
Glenn
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
YOU MAY THINK THAT MAKE MORE INTEREST GLENN BY MORE TEAMS MAKING THE PLAYOFFS BUT IT COULD BE A TURNOFF AS WELL.
NO MATTER HOW MANY TEAMS YOU PUT IN IT, THE TEAMS THAT GET LEFT OUT ARE GOING TO HAVE A GRIPE.
FOR INSTANCE IF YOU LET 30% IN THE PLAYOFFS THEN THE TEAMS THAT FALL IN THE 31/32 PERCENTILE ARE GOING TO JUSTIFY WHY THEY SHOULD BE IN.
IF YOU LET 40% IN THEN THE 41/42 PERCENTILE ARE GOING TO DO THE SAME THING.
IT WILL NEVER STOP BECAUSE EVERYONE WANTS TO GET IN.
ALSO YOU DON'T WANT TO SATURATE THE PLAYOFFS AS WELL.
THE BEST PERFORMING TEAMS SHOULD GET IN. NOW WHAT IS THE MEASURING STICK FOR THAT WHO KNOWS?
NO MATTER HOW MANY TEAMS YOU PUT IN IT, THE TEAMS THAT GET LEFT OUT ARE GOING TO HAVE A GRIPE.
FOR INSTANCE IF YOU LET 30% IN THE PLAYOFFS THEN THE TEAMS THAT FALL IN THE 31/32 PERCENTILE ARE GOING TO JUSTIFY WHY THEY SHOULD BE IN.
IF YOU LET 40% IN THEN THE 41/42 PERCENTILE ARE GOING TO DO THE SAME THING.
IT WILL NEVER STOP BECAUSE EVERYONE WANTS TO GET IN.
ALSO YOU DON'T WANT TO SATURATE THE PLAYOFFS AS WELL.
THE BEST PERFORMING TEAMS SHOULD GET IN. NOW WHAT IS THE MEASURING STICK FOR THAT WHO KNOWS?
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Glenneration X
- Posts: 1704
- Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:00 pm
- Location: Long Island, NY
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
Hey there Ormond....
I disagree with one of your points, and agree with the other.....
I don't think there's a fantasy player alive who could JUSTIFY allowing more than four teams into the playoffs for any system.
I do however believe every fantasy player would argue over the best method to determine those four teams....H2H vs. points vs. VP's....and I refuse to get into that argument!
Right now we allow two teams and the third team if it finishes in the top 10% in total points. Maybe you allow a third team from every league....its a paying spot anyway....and make that spot a play-in. The third and fourth place teams play week 14 to get into the overall and to finish in the league money. The winner's week 14 score then gets also used as their week 14 score for the overall....(shrug)....This would keep the top 2 teams in advantageous positions and still get top 2 money and a sort of bye into the overall while keeping interest in more teams who would have a chance at that 3rd or 4th place spots.
I don't know if that's the best idea, but it's an idea that would keep someone who's in 6th or 7th place or even 9th or 10th place possibly week 8 from throwing in the towel.
Glenn
I disagree with one of your points, and agree with the other.....
I don't think there's a fantasy player alive who could JUSTIFY allowing more than four teams into the playoffs for any system.
I do however believe every fantasy player would argue over the best method to determine those four teams....H2H vs. points vs. VP's....and I refuse to get into that argument!
Right now we allow two teams and the third team if it finishes in the top 10% in total points. Maybe you allow a third team from every league....its a paying spot anyway....and make that spot a play-in. The third and fourth place teams play week 14 to get into the overall and to finish in the league money. The winner's week 14 score then gets also used as their week 14 score for the overall....(shrug)....This would keep the top 2 teams in advantageous positions and still get top 2 money and a sort of bye into the overall while keeping interest in more teams who would have a chance at that 3rd or 4th place spots.
I don't know if that's the best idea, but it's an idea that would keep someone who's in 6th or 7th place or even 9th or 10th place possibly week 8 from throwing in the towel.
Glenn
Playoffs - Maybe I'm The Only One, But . . .
THANKS MAKES SENSE GLENN. I WOULD SUPPORT SOMETHING OF THAT NATURE.