AFFL and Question to the NFFC

KOTRAX · Post by **KOTRAX** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 10:16 am

I NEVER PLAYED IN THE AFFL. I GUESS SOMETHING REALLY WENT WRONG FROM THEM.

HAS ANYONE LOOKED AT THEIR TRACK RECORD IN THE PAST AS FAR AS ENTRIES AND PAYOUTS?

I KNOW THEY WERE SHORT THIS YEAR IN ENTRIES. HAVE THEY EVER BEEN SHORT BEFORE AND STILL PAID?

IF SO THEN I GUESS THE CLIENTELL FIGURED THEY WOULD COME THROUGH AGAIN WITH THE PAYOUTS.

IF NOT LIKE BILLY SAID THEY NEEDED TO LET THE CUSTOMERS KNOW. I JUST DONT HOPE THIS DOES RUIN IT FOR THE OTHER MAJOR FANTASY INDUSTRIES.

[ February 15, 2008, 04:17 PM: Message edited by: KOTRAX ]

LFW · Post by **LFW** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 10:20 am

Did any of the Platinum owners ask Neil about that 60,000 deficit before or during the season? When a deal looks too good to be true.... should raise some questions then and there right?

BillyWaz · Post by **BillyWaz** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 10:30 am

Originally posted by Lightning Fast Whip:
Did any of the Platinum owners ask Neil about that 60,000 deficit before or during the season? When a deal looks too good to be true.... should raise some questions then and there right? Good question.

I imagine they figured AFFL had the "back stash" through years of service, and probably figured it would be OK, just like the NFFC was in 2004, and WCOFF this past year (as both lost $$$, but were still able to pay).

Probably looked like a golden opportunity to win $100,000. 1 out of 108 is pretty good damn odds before the season starts!

Obviously TOO damn good.

We all know the saying... "If it looks too good to be true, it probably is".

BillyWaz · Post by **BillyWaz** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 10:36 am

Originally posted by KOTRAX:
I KNOW THEY WERE SHORT THIS YEAR IN ENTRIES. HAVE THEY EVER BEEN SHORT BEFORE AND STILL PAID?I know "Go Gettas" (Ryan Welsh) the 2007 NFFC Champ said something about last year, and having to go to court to get paid, but AFFL has denied that.

Originally posted by KOTRAX:

IF NOT LIKE BILLY SAID THEY NEEDED TO LET THE CUSTOMERS KNOW. I JUST DONT HOPE THIS DOES RUIN IT FOR THE OTHER MAJOR FANTASY INDUSTRIES. I hope not also. If people go to court over this, there could be ramifications down the line in the fantasy industry, and that is unfortunate for the quality companies out there who do what they are supposed to do (offer good service, pay on time, etc.)!

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 10:54 am

I will admit that I was surprised to learn from the Footballguys.com Message Boards that AFFL ran a mid-season contest when obviously the finances were going to be short from the regular season contest. I saw Neil's explanation for this, but no matter what the reason it doesn't look good now to have taken more money from your customers at that time. I think I'd pay those prizes off ASAP.

And in the future, if it looks too good, it probably is.

And to all game operators, let's stop all trying to be the biggest. Profitable is better than being the biggest. Build a model that works, treat the customer like gold and PAY ON TIME!!!

BillyWaz · Post by **BillyWaz** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 10:57 am

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

And to all game operators, let's stop all trying to be the biggest. Profitable is better than being the biggest. Build a model that works, treat the customer like gold and PAY ON TIME!!! Amen to that Greg!

It is better to be Jerry McGuire, than Drew Rosenhaus!

LFW · Post by **LFW** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:31 pm

A post from Lenny (Who talked to Neil at the last Conference) on this at WCOFF that is pretty brutally honest and raw....

www.wcoff.com/MessageBoard/tabid/143/fo ... fault.aspx

sportsbettingman · Post by **sportsbettingman** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:47 pm

I've never played in the AFFL...but if they had another "sport"...or were connected to another contest with a sport that overlaps the football season (like early baseball sign ups, or Hockey or Basketball)...they may have gambled that they could pay football winners with the Football, early baseball, and hockey/basketball entries...and continue to slowly dig out of debt via "borrowing from Peter to pay Paul"

Just an idea...but unless you knew these guys were wealthy or had a wealthy company backing them...those numbers were as clear as day based on the guaranteed payouts to entry monies.

Ugly.

~Lance

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 1:26 pm

Originally posted by Lightning Fast Whip:
A post from Lenny (Who talked to Neil at the last Conference) on this at WCOFF that is pretty brutally honest and raw....

www.wcoff.com/MessageBoard/tabid/143/fo ... fault.aspx Well, Lenny always was right to the point!

I kind of miss those type of posts on the other boards.

Team Legacy · Post by **Team Legacy** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:42 pm

Originally posted by sportsbettingman:
I've never played in the AFFL...but if they had another "sport"...or were connected to another contest with a sport that overlaps the football season (like early baseball sign ups, or Hockey or Basketball)...they may have gambled that they could pay football winners with the Football, early baseball, and hockey/basketball entries...and continue to slowly dig out of debt via "borrowing from Peter to pay Paul"

Just an idea...but unless you knew these guys were wealthy or had a wealthy company backing them...those numbers were as clear as day based on the guaranteed payouts to entry monies.

Ugly.

~Lance Great questions. It was MY understanding as a NEW participant this year that the great payout in the Platinum leagues were due to two reasons.

1. Expected # of signups
2. Heavy membership in the lower level leagues.

I did the math and knew he was "gunning" for a bigger high stakes crowd and with the guarantee he made, he appealed to many of us. For the most part, I think we all believed he had the money coming from those Gold and Silver leagues which seemed heavy in the # of participants.

He took a stab at the high stakes market and it didn't pay off. He was left with two choices -

1. Run the contest and pray for investors to honor his payouts.
2. Cancel the event, refund everyone their money in the platinum leagues and try another year.

We all know now how this played out and it is what it is. Can an investor come on board? Sure, and for our sake I hope one does, but at the end of the day, I hope he realizes that whatever he has or obtains from now until payout or court, belongs to the winners.

If he's getting good legal counsel they've surely told him this.

I guarantee you that a 4 letter website is worth some cash and the software is too. There's money there, it's just a matter of time before it gets in our hands thru one way or another.