What Is Going To Happen To High-Stakes Fantasy Football?

DoubleG · Post by **DoubleG** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:53 am

will people who roll over their winnings go through the same thing next year?

damn, if u are owed big money, please talk to an attorney ASAP. if wcoff gets you to accept something less than what you are owed, you probably give up your "rights" moving forward. don't let them stick it to you without finding out your legal options from someone working for YOU...not the wcoff spin machine

Quahogs · Post by **Quahogs** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:32 am

Originally posted by DoubleG:
sorry guys, i'm on vacation and haven't kept up to date on anything in the past 3-4 days.

is wcoff basically saying:
1. all the money is gone (otherwise they'd pay u)
2. they will accept your rollover winnings (which have already been spent by them)
3. it will buy them time to find a sucker investor

is that about right? winnerwinnerchickendinner. However wcoff would never admit to such obviously.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:35 am

Originally posted by DoubleG:
will people who roll over their winnings go through the same thing next year?

damn, if u are owed big money, please talk to an attorney ASAP. if wcoff gets you to accept something less than what you are owed, you probably give up your "rights" moving forward. don't let them stick it to you without finding out your legal options from someone working for YOU...not the wcoff spin machine Mark, Kevin Kirves posted this from their rules over the weekend. I'm not sure how this plays out, but it would appear that all players agreed to this when they signed up for the contest last year. I'm not making an opinion here, just posting what Kevin -- who is leading the baseball contest over there -- posted from their rules:

29. Release: Participants and co-managers hereby release, discharge and covenant not to sue GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC, their administrators, agents, officers, volunteers and employees, and other participants, organizers, any sponsors, licensors, vendors, media outlet, or advertisers. Participants and co-managers agree to hold those parties harmless from all liability, claim, demands, losses, or damages caused or alleged to be caused in whole or in part by the negligence of GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC. Participants and co-managers further agree that despite this waiver if they or anyone on their behalf makes a claim against GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC, participants and co-managers will indemnify, save, and hold harmless GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC their administrators, agents, officers, volunteers, and employees, organizers, sponsors, licensors and advertisers from any litigation expenses, attorney fees, loss liability, damage, or cost which may be incur as a result of such a claim. Participants and co-managers have read and fully understand the terms of this release, and further understand that they have given up substantial rights by signing the Official 2011 WCOFB Participant Application, and have signed it freely and without any induction or assurance of any nature and intend it to be complete and unconditional release of all liability to the greatest extent allowed by law and agree that if any portion of this agreement is held to be invalid, the balance, notwithstanding, shall continue in full force.

Tom Kessenich · Post by **Tom Kessenich** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:37 am

Originally posted by DoubleG:
will people who roll over their winnings go through the same thing next year?This is a very real concern Mark and unfortunately I see it being glossed over. Not sure why. Unless all past prize winners are paid in full and this year's baseball prize winners are guaranteed to be paid in full at season's end, I'm not sure why anyone should believe we won't see a repeat of the past six months.

Like Glenn (KOQ) said, if rollovers are given teams in exchange for prize money being paid in full it will give the appearance that all is well when the truth is nothing appears to have been changed, properly addressed or fixed. Instead, it just seems to be a way to try and buy more time while more money hopefully can be found. Isn't that exactly what we've been seeing the past six months?

[ August 15, 2011, 09:39 AM: Message edited by: Tom Kessenich ]

Quahogs · Post by **Quahogs** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:41 am

Greg, is rule "29" standard in these high stakes contests ? I mean who reads these things before you sign them ?

Tom Kessenich · Post by **Tom Kessenich** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:42 am

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
quote:Originally posted by DoubleG:
will people who roll over their winnings go through the same thing next year?

damn, if u are owed big money, please talk to an attorney ASAP. if wcoff gets you to accept something less than what you are owed, you probably give up your "rights" moving forward. don't let them stick it to you without finding out your legal options from someone working for YOU...not the wcoff spin machine Mark, Kevin Kirves posted this from their rules over the weekend. I'm not sure how this plays out, but it would appear that all players agreed to this when they signed up for the contest last year. I'm not making an opinion here, just posting what Kevin -- who is leading the baseball contest over there -- posted from their rules:

29. Release: Participants and co-managers hereby release, discharge and covenant not to sue GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC, their administrators, agents, officers, volunteers and employees, and other participants, organizers, any sponsors, licensors, vendors, media outlet, or advertisers. Participants and co-managers agree to hold those parties harmless from all liability, claim, demands, losses, or damages caused or alleged to be caused in whole or in part by the negligence of GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC. Participants and co-managers further agree that despite this waiver if they or anyone on their behalf makes a claim against GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC, participants and co-managers will indemnify, save, and hold harmless GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC their administrators, agents, officers, volunteers, and employees, organizers, sponsors, licensors and advertisers from any litigation expenses, attorney fees, loss liability, damage, or cost which may be incur as a result of such a claim. Participants and co-managers have read and fully understand the terms of this release, and further understand that they have given up substantial rights by signing the Official 2011 WCOFB Participant Application, and have signed it freely and without any induction or assurance of any nature and intend it to be complete and unconditional release of all liability to the greatest extent allowed by law and agree that if any portion of this agreement is held to be invalid, the balance, notwithstanding, shall continue in full force. [/QUOTE]Wow.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:47 am

Originally posted by Quahogs:
Greg, is rule "29" standard in these high stakes contests ? I mean who reads these things before you sign them ? We certainly don't have that language in our rules. I never thought about covering my butt that way. The only language we have in our rules is the right to cancel the contest and refund all participants in full. I'm not sure I've ever seen this type of language before. And you are right, nobody reads every line of the fine print when they sign up, but then again nobody also expects to go eight months without getting paid.

particra · Post by **particra** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:48 am

Originally posted by Quahogs:
Greg, is rule "29" standard in these high stakes contests ? I mean who reads these things before you sign them ? I would think that most courts would hold that clause unconscionable (particularly, where, as here, the activities are likely criminal) and/or vitiated due to the fact that the participant's agreement was fraudulently induced.

particra · Post by **particra** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:56 am

My favorite part is this sentence:

Participants and co-managers further agree that despite this waiver if they or anyone on their behalf makes a claim against GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC, participants and co-managers will indemnify, save, and hold harmless GridIron Fantasy Sports LLC their administrators, agents, officers, volunteers, and employees, organizers, sponsors, licensors and advertisers from any litigation expenses, attorney fees, loss liability, damage, or cost which may be incur as a result of such a claim.

If you read that the way it's written, it says not only that you can't sue them, but that IF YOU sue them you have to pay all of their legal fees and expenses. You also have to indemnify them (i.e. pay yourself what you win). Haha.

BLACKHAND · Post by **BLACKHAND** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:02 am

i know i am not owed money and some might not think my opinion counts but this is bad for the fantasy biz in whole. it is a disgrace for them to ask for signups when people are owed money from last year. im not looking to be funny but if that guy owed me money from football all that comes across my mind is eliot ness throwing frank nitty off the roof in the movie capone. rollovers my azz. just to stick new suckers and make more of a mess for high stakes ff.