NFFC Message Boards

I started this thread to address an important issue that might not be noticed by many people because it's buried in a thread name that many people might not even visit. The original thread is Boston Classic League Draft Spots. Please read through that one first for the details, but the summary is that the Boston Classic league had a no-show phone-in participant and his team was drafted for him strictly from Average Draft Position (ADP), w/ no regard for suspensions, injuries, filling starting rosters first or unrealistically-drafted positions (i.e. 4 QBs I heard, but haven't seen the whole team). This certainly gave the other 13 teams in this league an advantage, as I'm sure several players fell to them that otherwise would not have.

This is a very unfortunate situation for the operators and players in the NFFC. I am also in the camp that believes that the integrity of the entire event has been compromised because of this.

IMO, here's how it should've been handled:

1. There seems to be some confusion as to who exactly Seth spoke w/ from Fanball about this. Greg said it wasn't him. For something this important, it absolutely should've been either Greg, Tom and/or Ryan.

2. The solution should've been to try as much as possible to mimic what the majority of live owners would do in a draft. I know we're all different, but I'm also pretty sure most of us fill our 8 starting position player spots before drafting our bench, DST and kickers. So using ADP was fine, as long as if the ADP list hit a 5th WR, 4th RB, 2nd TE or 2nd QB before filling all other starting lineup spots, you should've skipped over that player. To clarify further, once you filled his WR or RB starting spots and also filled the flex, then another WR or RB (whichever one wasn't yet filled) should've been filled before taking an excess/bench WR or RB. We also see that most teams tend to take a 2nd QB in rounds 9-12 or so, a 2nd TE maybe there or a bit earlier, DST around there and kickers quite a bit later. Discussion should've taken place w/ Fanball personnel and a decision made as to exactly which rounds these bench players would be taken. But I think the other 13 owners could've probably lived w/ that if it were explained to them upfront. Of course, if we're all honest here, I'll bet most of them were too busy jumping for joy inside at the early Christmas/Hanukkah present that just landed on their laps.

Ok, so that is all water under the bridge and can be filed in the "lessons learned" area for future reference.


Now how do we rectify this?

I think the biggest concern here is obviously the fact that these 13 owners are likely to have stronger teams than almost all other leagues because they essentially drafted in a 13 or 13.5 team league. So how exactly does that affect the rest of us? As far as the competition within that league for the top 3 spots, that's pretty much their business; it doesn't affect us. They're competing for the same amount of league prizes that we are, albeit against one or a half of one less owner. No biggie. More on this league's "private" competition later.

However, the major concern is how this affects the overall competition during the playoffs. First, let's address the possibility that there's likely a stronger chance of some of the teams beyond the top 3 finishers also getting into the playoffs via the "top 10% in the overall (300+ team) competition", as that's what affects the most people. Here's a suggestion for rectifying that: increase the number of teams that make the playoffs this way by the number of teams from this league that make it that way. For example, if we have 300 teams (I don't recall the exact number), then normally, any team whose total points are in the top 30 would make the playoffs. So if 5 more teams beyond the top 3 make it from this league, then let the top overall 35 teams in. If one of those extra 5 teams allowed also comes from this league, then let the next overall one (36th) from outside this league in. If two from this league, 2 more, and so on. It's not a perfect solution, as it creates more competition for the grand prizes, but it really isn't fair to let this 13-team league compete for those "top 10% entries" against all of the other 14-team leagues. To me, this is a valid compromise.

As for the competition within this league for their top 3 playoff spots, that doesn't really affect the rest of us, other than the fact that maybe we wish we were in this league. But it's still something that should be considered to maintain the integrity of the prizes awarded within this league ($5k 1st place, etc.). As someone pointed out, the teams who get to play against this team for the first few weeks - until the original owner hits the wire to hopefully patch up the holes - have a definite advantage in the head-to-head (H2H) competition. This is a tough one.

Here are some possible options:

1. Do you put out to this league a vote (or maybe just a private vote among Fanball personnel?) to decide upon a number of weeks it would/should take to patch up this team and until then, play this league as an "All-play" format (in which the top 7 scoring teams each week get a win and the rest a loss)? So... if it's decided that Eric should be able to get this team back on track in 3 weeks, then the first 3 weeks of the season are played as "All play". This at least alleviates some teams from getting easy wins. It's still not perfect though because then, not every team in the league ever even has to face Eric's team. But we can't know at this point if that's an advantage or disadvantage. Who knows? Maybe by week 4 or 5 his team is a powerhouse, so it could be a disadvantage?

2. Just play the whole season within this league only as "All play"?

3. Simply toss out the H2H component in this league only and award the top 3 playoff spots to the top 3 point scorers?

4. Remove the offending team from the league and play this out as a 13-team league. I know Greg said he didn't plan to do that, but why not? This would make it easier to make the overall playoffs from this league compared to others because of one less team to beat. However, can we conclude that this is balanced out by the fact that the compeition between these 13 teams should be a bit fiercer than in other leagues due to the added strength of their teams?

I believe personally that option 4 above is the best solution.

Lastly, there doesn't seem to be anything that can be done now to fix the fact that any playoff teams from this league have a chance to be stronger than those from all other leagues. That said, a popular, but certainly debateable, opinion regarding the playoff sprint is that it's basically a "lottery", in which the "luckiest" team over 3 weeks wins anyway. This is supported by the fact that it seems that very seldom does a top scoring regular season team win the overall $100k prize, and also that the last seed (65th?) in last year's playoffs won the $100k (no offense to Steve ).

So as long as the rest of the owners from all of the other leagues beyond this one have a solution in place to ensure that THEIR odds of making the playoffs haven't been reduced by this mistake, that's probably all that can be done in this area.

I know I've rambled quite a bit here and I'm just trying to help maintain the integrity of the event I love so much. If I've missed any important issues, let's continue discussing... but SOON please. This situation must be addressed immediately, before the season starts this Thurs. night.

Respectfully,
Mike Sanda

[ September 05, 2010, 06:04 PM: Message edited by: Sandman62 ]

Mike - I think we are getting carried away with trying to change a bunch of rules for this league.

Come week 8 or so this team will probably be better than a few teams out there. The problem is in the meantime what happens?

At the end of the day it's Greg's call, but I have already said that I would be willing to allow this team to make pickups and drop his IR players in order to field a competitive team........before week 1. Maybe Greg could put it to a vote in the league or just make the decision himself? IDK


BTW - I don't appreciate this comment ( "Of course, if we're all honest here, I'll bet most of them were too busy jumping for joy inside at the early Christmas/Hanukkah present that just landed on their laps. [Wink] ") and I'm sure Eddie and Frank don't either. I want to win as much as anyone else here, but not like this and just for the record we all voiced our opinion when IR guys started getting drafted. I was definitely not OK with it, but I wasn't in charge and it's not the 13 other team's fault this happened either.

nelson , your right. you were saying the same thing eddie and i were saying about guys on ir. the problem i see is not the 100k prize which is a crapshoot for 3 weeks. it is the free win for those that play him in the begining of the year. its not right for some teams to get a free win and others dont get that. i dont believe in santa anymore so i do want anything for free and dont want others getting anything free.

Yes, come week 8 the team may be better. That's exactly the problem though - the teams that face him before that get an easy win, those after do not.

Do you really think that hitting the wire now, after 266 players were drafted, would help him improve his team much?

Lastly, just to expand slightly upon my suggestion #4 above to remove this team from the league and play w/ 13... I had forgotten that that would still leave one extra week after each team had played the other 12. You could either do All-play for that week or better still, KEEP that team in the league, freeze his roster, and just award everyone a win when they play that team.

Maybe I should mind my own business as far as this league goes, as the competition WITHIN this league doesn't affect me. But it sets a precedent and could in the future. However, the possibility of extra teams from this league making the playoffs via the 10% rule due to the strength of their teams because of the ADP-drafted team DOES affect me and about 300 other owners. That's the main reason I started this thread.

I believe the NFFC operators have great integrity or I wouldn't pony up the money I do to compete in their events. But this problem, IMO, should absolutely NOT be swept under the rug if that integrity is to be maintained.

Also, I mean no personal offense by that comment, but I do still think that most people (notice I never said "all of you"), even if they did speak up, would deep down inside be thankful for the situation and that is not at all fair to 300 other people (more if you count co-managers).

[ September 05, 2010, 06:59 PM: Message edited by: Sandman62 ]

Yes, I think hitting FAAB now would help. I just pulled up my list of WR's that were not drafted. It's nothing special but he could get 3 #3's to fill his lineup or only 2 if Housh signs soon.

At the end of the day Rice and V-Jax were going to get drafted and they did in fact get drafted in other leagues. So there are going to be teams that play the teams that own Rice and V-Jax early in the year and then there will be teams that play those later in the year if and when they are signed or healthy.


Listen it's not perfect but it's one solution.


Actually now that I think about it......It's all your fault! Originally you were signed up for this league and then went to NY which caused this whole mess in the first place.

Sandman...

I remained in this league even though it was already stacked with quality owners, and for someone to attack me or any of the owners who remained, without any knowledge what went down is ludricous.

BTw....I believe you are one of the players to back out of this league and headed to citifield. So maybe deep down you wished you had remained in Bosten...

A.A.

C'mon guys, I didn't leave Boston because I feared the group. We didn't want to do 3 straight drafts w/ the same exact group, that's all. Geez. :rolleyes:

Listen, there were 13 of you there. How many adamantly objected to the draft proceeding the way it did? If less than 7, then I stand by my "most probably liked the situation" comment.

BTW, what makes you think I have no knowledge of this league? The walls have ears.

[ September 05, 2010, 08:17 PM: Message edited by: Sandman62 ]

The players should be catching zero grief here.

This situation was botched by the staff. This should never have happened but finding a remedy to appease all parties could be tough to find.

I cannot help but wonder if this league should be re-drafted online?

Just thinking out loud here but what could be fairer to the players in this league AND the rest of the players in the competition.

---

I would like to see the draft results from this league. I am curious to see the other teams and breakdown the what-ifs. Anyone one want to post it?

Originally posted by Sandman62:
C'mon guys, I didn't leave Boston because I feared the group. Geez. :rolleyes:

Listen, there were 13 of you there. How many adamantly objected to the draft proceeding the way it did? If less than 7, then I stand by my "most probably liked the situation" comment.

BTW, what makes you think I have no knowledge of this league? The walls have ears. I see three players that shouldn't have got drafted - Leinart, Tate, and Avery.

Hardesty was drafted in every league I drafted in Vegas.

Rice, Jackson, and Housh were drafted in the top 10 rounds in most every draft I saw.

So team two wins week 1. Who's to say they don't score 150+ and they would have won anyway?

With those four players drafted (Hardesty, Tate, Avery and Leinart), there are four better players in the player pool.

It's unfortunate, but it isn't a event changer. The team that scores the most points in weeks 14-16 will win the contest.

Originally posted by Sandman62:
This certainly gave the other 13 teams in this league an advantage, as I'm sure several players fell to them that otherwise would not have.

I am also in the camp that believes that the integrity of the entire event has been compromised because of this.

Every year people join the main event, draft their team and then basically ignore for the rest of the season. This is no different than that, except a few extra players were rostered who normally wouldn't have been.

Seriously, there are numerous leagues each season with deadbeat owners.....the fact that this deadbeat was revealed on draft day does nothing to change the lack of equality that is prevalent in a national contest.

Does is suck? yes.....should've been handled differently? yes....(sorry, but lack of a brain was used when rostering the IR players)......is this league any better or worse than all the others due to this?.....nope.

The sky isn't falling and this league will go on just as the rest.

As far as how this was handled, that is obviously another story.