Feedback Needed On DC And Auction Championship Prizes

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 5:10 am

Mike, I'm not looking for a fight, just a discussion. You had $9,350 in league prizes and $350 in overall prizes per league for a total of $9,700. If I'm looking at that wrong, correct me, but it does look like you have league and overall prizes together like I had.

We didn't offer 12-team DCs or auctions last year when we went to the overall championship concept and heck we barely got one 14-teamer of each in each city. I'll stick to the Classic concept in these formats going forward. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough initially.

I'll go with what you folks think Mike. Again, that's what this discussion is for.

RedRyder · Post by **RedRyder** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 5:33 am

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
quote:Originally posted by RedRyder:
I'm not a fan of these Overall championship hybrids, but you got to do what you got to do to appeal to the masses and grow your business (ie. RBs at a full PPR).

Less money to the overall, more to the leagues is my vote.

I'll play in the Auction again this year, but rather do a $1300 single league DC. Will you offer one this year? We almost had enough folks interested last year. I will gladly offer $1300 Auction and DCs this year as those have been part of the NFFC since Year One. We always had a few folks who wanted to step up that game. But I'd love to keep them part of the overall championship as well, just like we do it for $1300 auctions in baseball. Send the same $1,625 to the overall and keep the remaining percentage within the league, thus providing bigger league prizes.

Sound good? [/QUOTE]Doesn't sound good to me, as I'm looking for stand alone leagues, not leagues where some of the money goes into an overall pot.

I want to play in a league where if I win it, I get the most reward and not have to go to a play-off with other league leaders and fight for more prize rewards. Too much of a crap shoot for me.

Want about a Super Satellite DC? Which would not be part of the Overall. If you offered something like that, you can put my name down right now.

Again, I get that you have to do what you have to do to make your contests appealing to most and to grow your business. You asked for opinions, so I'm just giving mine. Like I said, I will still play in the Auction. I need to put my money in leagues where I can maximize my return most effectively. I know I will be doing both Mains, so really looking for single/non-overall leagues to play in after that. My motto: ROI, ROI & ROI.

Great job btw by you and Tom getting active on these boards and planning the NFFC early! Can't wait to start seeing some announcements!

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 5:40 am

I totally understand what you're saying Jules. The overall prizes are also paying out based on the number of leagues. So right now we are budgeting for four leagues and four overall prizes. If you win your league, you're likely also adding to your prize pool and quite possibly more than if we just had stand-alone leagues. The second and third place winners are likely not going to win as much as they would in stand-alone leagues, but the league champ likely will win more.

When we had $650 stand-alone leagues we had the same amount each year in each city. I'm hopeful that national contests grow these "niche" events and brings more notoriety to the overall winners. Maybe I'm wrong, but I am trying to reward each league champ and grow these "niche" contests. I enjoy the discussions and if I'm proven wrong I'll admit it and move on. But somehow comparing one DC winner to another is the way to go and if all of you say you just want a token prize then I'll do it. But right now I'd like to see more than that.

Keep the discussion flowing. We're talking football again. The NFL should pay attention. We're sick of all the rest. Let's play football.

RedRyder · Post by **RedRyder** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:37 am

I don't think you will be wrong Greg and I hope you do grow the DC event, because I love DCs. I wish more folks would play in them, it seems like there is a misconception that they are boring, so if you can help shatter that, all the better!!

I am just going to be very mindful this year of where I invest my money, thus looking for the best ROI. And you already know the NFFC will be getting a huge chuck of it, so no worries there.

Glenneration X · Post by **Glenneration X** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:49 am

A big way to grow DC's would be to get the live scoring accurate. I know this has been discussed in other threads, still I think it's an important component to the enjoyment factor for these leagues.

Coltsfan · Post by **Coltsfan** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:28 am

Originally posted by Glenneration X:
A big way to grow DC's would be to get the live scoring accurate. I know this has been discussed in other threads, still I think it's an important component to the enjoyment factor for these leagues. I agree 100% with this. In fact, I'll be picking where I play my DC's based on having live scoring. It zaps a lot of the fun out of DC's when you don't know how you're doing until a day or two after the games are over.

Wayne

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:30 am

Originally posted by Glenneration X:
A big way to grow DC's would be to get the live scoring accurate. I know this has been discussed in other threads, still I think it's an important component to the enjoyment factor for these leagues. Well, I think we have a better shot at getting that done this year over last year. Just saying.

We will definitely create a thread for these type of suggestions and get started on the software sooner rather than later. We have the back-end software ready to go from the last season we ran the NFFC with STATS (2009), but we still need to brush it off, grease the wheels, add oil and enhance the tools to make it the best we can be. This would be a good place to start with the DC's.

I think we'll grow the DC format in many ways this year and that's why this part of the software will be important. We can grow these through Slow Drafts and more Online offerings. I think folks want to do more football drafts and less FAAB pickups, which makes DCs the ideal format.

mikeybok · Post by **mikeybok** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:16 am

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
Mike, I'm not looking for a fight, just a discussion. You had $9,350 in league prizes and $350 in overall prizes per league for a total of $9,700. If I'm looking at that wrong, correct me,It oddly seems to me like you are causing an argument (I personally just don't want to be misquoted). But I'll correct you as you asked me too (although I am sure it will cause me more pain to do so). I had 9000 for league prizes (5k+3k+1k) and and 350 for the overall .... for a total of 9350. It's all up above if you are willing to look back at my previous posts.

Back on topic. I recommend about 3-5% of the prize money going to the overall. Even RedRyder would probably be OK with that figure. It appears you have 20-25% going to the overall right now. It really does seem like you more interested in selling that figure to us than you are in considering adjusting it.

It seems you tried your method last year with 10K and it didn't work at all (you lost 1/2 your contestants). Of those who still got in the DC's, many were very unhappy with the big overall prize.

The real question is ... Why are you so sold on a Big Overall prize for the DC? Or any overall prize for the DC for that matter? You seem to be convinced that a big prize is the correct answer to making this contest a Big Hit. After last year it seems like you would seriously reconsider this point of view (not just adjust the payouts a little).

[ April 08, 2011, 03:26 PM: Message edited by: Very Ugly Yellow Tomatoes ]

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:50 am

I stand corrected on your total prize payout Mike. Thanks for pointing that out. Right now I have 18.2% of the prize money going to the overall prizes; 81.8% to the league prizes. Last year was definitely much, much higher towards the overall prizes.

In 2009, we had 3 $650 private NFFC Classic Auction Leagues (1 in each city) and 4 NFFC Classic Draft Champions Leagues. We also had 1 NFFC Primetime Auction League and 2 NFFC Draft Champions Leagues. Last year we had 4 DCs and 4 Auctions at $800-$850 per team, so we definitely didn't have half the teams last year. Was it the format or the price increases that reduced our numbers? I hope someone tells me. Going one step further: In 2008, we had 4 DCs and 4 Auctions, all private (3 of each at $650 and 1 of each at $1300).

I think we have Mike's point: VERY LITTLE PRIZE MONEY TO THE NATIONAL CONTESTS. Got it. Pay higher overall. Pay 95-97% to the leagues.

And if everyone wants that we'll make it happen. But maybe we can grow these formats with a little more money than that to the overall prize pool. Keep the comments coming and we'll figure it out together. Thanks all.

[ April 08, 2011, 03:57 PM: Message edited by: Greg Ambrosius ]

BillyWaz · Post by **BillyWaz** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:56 am

Originally posted by Very Ugly Yellow Tomatoes:
quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
We don't have 12-team Auction or DC live contests, so I'm not sure where that comparison comes into play.
You had 12 team DC's two years ago (I know because we won one of them). With your post about leaning towards more 12 team leagues this year ... I guess it was stupid of me to think you might bring the 12 team DC back ... I am just an idiot I guess.

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

$800 overall prize is 100% OK with me. Everyone including Billy has wanted more money into the leagues. Billy also wants a $5000 top prize but he needs to realize he can't have it both ways. You introduced the overall prize and lost 1/2 your leagues last year.
[/QUOTE]Mike,

I imagine the reason Greg wants the overall to be higher is because THAT is what is going to attract new business. He knows that the "regulars" are going to jump in no matter what, and he is probably trying to drum up more new business.

And yes, you can have it both ways if they have enough leagues. A little more than what he proposed into the leagues, and an extra $5,000 to the winner is possible.

I would think Bill Cleavenger is pretty happy that it was an $8,000 grand prize last year.

I'm cool with whatever, and if something has to be sacrificed, then I vote to cut the overall prize. However, having the overall prize be less than 1st place in the each league seems weird to me.

I don't think you can go any lower than $3,000......because I don't see the point of the overall if it isn't worth something.

[ April 08, 2011, 04:57 PM: Message edited by: BillyWaz ]