Tim Tebow - Let's Talk

Old School · Post by **Old School** » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:20 am

Originally posted by THE_BLACKHAND:
i dont want either one but you sure take this hard. lol. take a chill pill man. its only football.

down goes tebow Ok Frank. Bu tif I see Tebow on your roster next year, I'll razz u till the cows come home. and yes, I'm a little ticked already today having a bad week in the championship round .

Tebow = Rocky

Old School · Post by **Old School** » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:26 am

Originally posted by CoMoHusker:
quote:Originally posted by Old School:
quote:Originally posted by CoMoHusker:
quote:Originally posted by Old School:
quote:Originally posted by Tom Kessenich:
For those starting Tebow this week, what are your projections against the Patriots?

I keep coming up with 250 yards passing, 2 TDs and 45-50 yards rushing. But I really think that could be conservative. It's not like the Patriots have been gashed only by elite QBs. They've been torn apart by nearly everyone. They give up a lot of big plays downfield and you know Tebow will take plenty of shots as he always does. The Patriots are so bad in the secondary it's not a reach to see him connecting with Thomas and/or Decker for TD bombs and maybe Rod Smith too.

I tend to be conservative when it comes to projecting how my players will do (helps prevent any major letdowns

) but I really think he has Top 5 potential this week. The matchup is insanely good. Well, u know how I feel tom and I am starting him in a couple championships this weekend.

Also, I'd like to nominate my least favorite player who is Brandon Lloyd. He basically quit because he didnt want to play for losers and for Tebow. So how does it feel, Brandon, to be on the worst team in football trying to catch passes from a far more inaccurate passer in Bradford, while youre old team heads for the playoffs? :rolleyes: [/QUOTE]What criteria is being used to determine how accurate of a passer Tebow is when compared to Bradford? The obvious one should be completion percentage, in which Tebow ranks dead last in the NFL.

It also should be pointed out that Bradford is far from healthy which I'm sure impacts his accuracy. [/QUOTE]Sam Bradford last night 41%

no dropped passes that i saw

Tim Tebow on sunday 52% WITH AT LEAST 6 perfectly thrown dropped passes which puts him at least 65% if they catch those. [/QUOTE]So, a one game sample The completion numbers I provided were for the year.

Also, out of Tebow's 19 incompletions on Sunday how many were bad throws where the receiver didn't even have a chance to catch the ball? My point being, that it's a two way street.

I've never seen dropped passes talked about so much with any other QB. Receivers drop passes every week but for whatever reason they are magnified when it comes to justifying Tebow's performance. I guess that's needed for a guy completing 48% of his passes.

Statistics would indicate that he should perform much better in the passing game this week. The Patriots have made pretty much every QB fantasy relevant against them this year and only has that hurt them a couple times. Having guys like Brady, Welker, and Gronk on the other side of the ball sure help. I've picked the Broncos to win five out of six weeks now so I have been routing for them. The games have mostly been difficult to watch up until the fourth quarter but the result has been great. I think that the Bronco D will have to hold the Patriots to 24 points or less to have a shot this week. I haven't ruled out picking them yet but it will be tough. [/QUOTE]Agree Husker on MOST of your points here. Do you think this may be the most-watched game of the year? Even the haters and naysayers will watch this game.

[ December 13, 2011, 04:26 PM: Message edited by: Old School ]

BLACKHAND · Post by **BLACKHAND** » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:26 am

dont worry joe , cant pull that trigger. this is the first chapter with more to come. if we are talking standup guy then he is MVP. as a qb time will tell.

Old School · Post by **Old School** » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:31 am

Originally posted by THE_BLACKHAND:
dont worry joe , cant pull that trigger. this is the first chapter with more to come. if we are talking standup guy then he is MVP. as a qb time will tell. On an unrelated note, I was born not far from you in Poughkeepsie NY and have some fam in Danbury CT

Ry's Guys · Post by **Ry's Guys** » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:36 am

I'd like to see a breakdown of Tebow's passing this year. 18-24 in the 4th Q and OT are certainly impressive numbers at face value. Does anyone know of a site that would show 0-9 yard passes, 10-19 yard passes and so on? Passing numbers in the last five minutes of a game (against a prevent defense).

My take on Tebow's numbers this week, he threw a LOT of underneath stuff in the last five minutes and overtime.

I didn't see 6 drops. In fact they went through his drops, basically FOX or CBS (i forget) was trying to build him up and blame his receivers when he was 3-16 through three quarters. They showed 2 and a half drops. Maybe its my hating eyes but the pass to Thomas on the post looked like it was overthrown. I don't remember three drops in the 4th quarter & OT. Drops are part of the game. To say he could have been near 65% completion if his receivers didn't drop any passes is like saying I could have had six wives if it wasn't illegal and the one and only Mrs. Sorge would agree to it . NOT!

Ask Matt Ryan about drops this year! Every quarterback in the league deals with drops. Heck Eli Manning would be close to Aaron Rodgers numbers IF Cruz didn't drop 3 balls a game!

Here are the facts...Tebow is 7-1 as a starter. Yawn. Kyle Orton was 6-0 as a starter for the Broncos in McDumbiels first year. Quarterback win loss record is an overrated stat. Interesting to look at but overrated.

Tebow has the worst completion % in the league 48.5%. That means I could flip a coin 1000 times and probably have a higher percentage of heads and tails than Tebow completions!!! John Fox came out and said "teams are daring us to throw it". That tells me he is throwing against single coverage for the first 55 minutes of games and against a prevent defense the last 5 minutes or so.

48.5%!!! We are talking Ryan Leaf numbers here! I get that he has pulled out some improbable comebacks but the Pro-Tebows somehow only see Tebow winning the game.

I'm going to find replays of his 11 Touchdown passes and see how many were legitimate NFL throws and how many were scrambling OOPS look at that guy, someone forgot to guard him TD's like the game winner against the Vikes.

I also agree with Sandman...rev up that machine for next years draft!!! Take Tebow before any of the QB's he mentioned....PLEASE.

I guess I'm a hater but he hasn't showed me any talent as an NFL quarterback. As far as fantasy goes? I don't like to have the 10th-12th rated quarterback in a league that rewards you so much for great quarterback play. You can have your 20-22 points most games. For me that is a bad week at quarterback!

TR · Post by TR » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:36 am

Originally posted by Old School:
quote:Originally posted by THE_BLACKHAND:
tebow also has a very good defense that sets him up to do well. rams defense stinks. bradford is playing hurt and his wr 's and o line is a mess. bradford over tebow by a knockout in the 2nd round. good. then u draft Bradford and roll with him then and I'll draft Tebow. We'll see how that ends . Funny how u make excuses for Bradford, like Tebow has any talent around him on offense.In case you didnt notice, Tebow' s line sucks too. He
(unlike Bradford) has the ability to avoid sacks.

And no one knocks out Tebow.... [/QUOTE]I think bradford and tebow are both overhyped and neither anything great...Pouncey should have won Offensive Rookie Of Year over bradford.

TR · Post by TR » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:39 am

Originally posted by Old School:
quote:Originally posted by THE_BLACKHAND:
i dont want either one but you sure take this hard. lol. take a chill pill man. its only football.

down goes tebow Ok Frank. Bu tif I see Tebow on your roster next year, I'll razz u till the cows come home. and yes, I'm a little ticked already today having a bad week in the championship round .

Tebow = Rocky [/QUOTE]Tebow=white version of vince young

Tom Kessenich · Post by **Tom Kessenich** » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:41 am

Originally posted by Bullgod:
You can have your 20-22 points most games. For me that is a bad week at quarterback! I disagree Pat. The reality is only three teams are going to have Rodgers, Brees and Brady. So that means the other 9/11 have to find a reliable starter elsewhere. Now Tebow's upside hasn't yet been as high as guys like Stafford, Cam or Eli and I would start all of them over Tebow most weeks. But as I posted several pages back, Tebow's floor is also lower than every QB not named Rodgers, Brees or Brady. So while other QBs have tossed up a stinker or two (or sometimes three or four), Tebow hasn't done that yet. In a season which has seen so much volatility I think that type of consistency and reliability is huge.

If you told me I could take QB A who scored 18 points per week or QB B who scored 25 points one week and 11 the next, I'm taking QB A. Sure I might not get the upside, but the downside isn't likely to hurt me and that reliability should give my team a better chance to do well each week.

Sandman62 · Post by **Sandman62** » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:41 am

Originally posted by DoubleG:
quote:Originally posted by Sandman62:
My bad Tom. Yes, you did list the teams who were top 15 in BOTH offense and defense. But I'd guess you didn't use fantasy points against or split defense into passing or rushing, as I did, correct? IOW, as long as the defense is either terrible all-around or terrible at either pass or run AND terrible on offense, then any team including the Broncos should be able to take advantage.

I won't be surprised if he scores well for NFFC this week, given the record-setting ineptitude of the Pats passing D. sandman - whether tebow has been playing against good defenses in your opinion is kinda moot. he plays against whatever teams are on the broncos schedule.

it's obvious you have a bias against tebow (just a guess, but did you miss on tebow in most of your leagues?). [/QUOTE]Yes he does. And some schedules are obviously easier than others.

And no, we didn't miss on Tebow, as we didn't go hard after him like most did.

And I do NOT have a bias against him personally. Bottom line for fantasy purposes is that he's been the 11th or 13th best NFFC QB since he took over (average or median), and arguably against some terrible and/or beat-up teams. His current floor is 18-20 PPG, and he's averaging 21 PPG - and that's with all the good fortune provided by his schedule, the strength of his defense, McGahee, Prater, etc.. I think long-term he'll have a lower floor. It would not be the first or last time if I'm wrong.

If ...
(a) you think he can sustain this production when it already takes near-miracles each week to do so, and
(b) you feel the last 8 opponents he's faced are truly representative of what he can expect on a typical full year schedule, and
(c) you prefer to draft a QB later and are ok with one who may or may not end up in the top 14 of NFFC starters... then have at it! He's all yours!

But no matter how long this debate goes on, his schedule has afforded him the luck of us not realizing the ultimate conclusion of this debate until next year.

Old School · Post by **Old School** » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:42 am

Originally posted by TR:
quote:Originally posted by Old School:
quote:Originally posted by THE_BLACKHAND:
i dont want either one but you sure take this hard. lol. take a chill pill man. its only football.

down goes tebow Ok Frank. Bu tif I see Tebow on your roster next year, I'll razz u till the cows come home. and yes, I'm a little ticked already today having a bad week in the championship round .

Tebow = Rocky [/QUOTE]Tebow=white version of vince young [/QUOTE]Exactly. Tebow builds hospitals in third-world countries and V Young makes it rain in strip clubs.