NFFC Classic: Best Return On Investment In The NFFC

Quahogs · Post by **Quahogs** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:21 am

Originally posted by Hells Satans:
quote:Originally posted by Quahogs:
A nice Classic odds thread and no status on Wednesday's Sep 7 contest ? Last I checked there were two teams so far right ? I'm tempted to take team #3 here. (Sep 6 tuesday is the Super so that's a no go). I think you can get the Sep 7 to fill don't you think Greg ? If I do a 3rd, this would likely be the one. [/QUOTE]The top 3 move forward. Then it's a crap shoot (1 out of 55 or so for 100k). That caught my eye.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:23 am

Originally posted by RoadKing:
I recieved an email from FGuys about getting in on the action to win $125,000 for only $350 entry fee. Nice, and I only need to compete against 1400 other teams.
Play NFFC!!! This whole BIG CARROT has me wondering aloud what is important to the players. Trust me, they are speaking LOUD and CLEAR that the big, big, big grand prize is what they are after. And they said that before, chasing WCOFF's $300,000 grand prize.

The FBG contest obviously has a fantastic promotional partner and that has helped with the final numbers. We never wanted to go above 720 teams in order to give the customers fair odds of winning. That likely hurt us last year when we stopped signups at 720 teams. At the time, the FBG contest was at 850 teams and they grew to 1,608 teams. We again came out with a smaller guaranteed grand prize this year and bigger league prizes with better odds of winning the overall, and people instead gravitated to the bigger grand prize.

Again, I understand and it makes sense. But look at the two contests:

NFFC Online Championship:
1st Place League Prize = $1,400
2nd Place League Prize = $700

FBG Online Championship
1st Place League Prize = $1,600
2nd Place League Prize = $350

Everyone always tells me that the league prize is the key, that winning the overall is so tough that the key is making sure people get rewarded for league prizes. So we are giving out more per league, making sure two people at least double their money and guaranteeing a $40,000 grand prize. Yet that big carrot is the key.

There's no doubt that we'll be more aggressive with our grand prize in this format in the future. It makes sense to be and I think people like our 12-team game format with KDS and 3RR. I will keep the league prizes as is, unless you folks tell me it doesn't make sense for second place to make a profit. This is all understandable because most of us chase the lottery's biggest prize too, but I was hoping the league prizes carried more weight. Now I know.

It's all good and I'm happy that both contests are excelling beyond our wildest expectations. Next year we'll step up to the plate differently and consumers will be the big winners.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:30 am

Originally posted by BillyWaz:
quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:

We just know that in future years this six-figure grand prize will be jeopardized. The players have spoken loud and clear about the 14-Team format both in the Main Event and in the Online Championship. That's not a bad thing, but next year it's obvious that our priorities will have to change as well. The 12-Team format will definitely grow in the NFFC beyond our $100,000 grand prize as will the 12-Team Online Championship. The market is there. The second weekend will be our major focus going forward. Multiple city drafts will remain, but not on Labor Day weekend. It's obvious that the Classic will always remain in the NFFC, but slightly different.

I'll take some of the blame because we kept the Classic only on the first weekend and with the demise of the WCOFF the second weekend became more of a focus for some of our customers. That hurt the Primetime live drafts on the first weekend and definitely hurt the Classic. Next year will be different from that standpoint and we won't be in this situation again. NFL kickoff weekend will be our major focus.
I don't think you should "give up" just yet, Greg.

I obviously LOVE the 14 team format, and would hate to see it (or any of the auctions and DC's) get removed from what the NFFC owns.....Labor Day weekend.

I think with WCOFF's ineptness, the lockout, and a bad economy, it has obviously affected your numbers this year. I can almost GUARANTEE that 2 out of those 3 won't be an issue next year (hopefully 3 of 3?

).

I was shocked that the 14 team online didn't do well, but I still think a lot of the 14 team events (Main, Supers, etc.) are PILLARS of what the NFFC is.

So when you say no multiple cities, are you just considering Vegas Labor Day weekend, or both NY and Vegas? Obviously Chicago will be nixed (which is a shame), but I understand.

I'm worried about the auctions and DC's, as if they are on the 2nd weekend, it is going to be tough for some of us to pack in all these drafts.......although it will be fun trying!

[/QUOTE]We'll see how it plays out Billy, but yeah I doubt we'll knock heads with vacationers much longer on Labor Day weekend on the East Coast and Chicago. We agree that the 14-team Classic Main Event, Supers, Ultimates, Auctions and DCs have their merits and we'll try to fit them all in, but it will be tough. I kind of have a plan and maybe it will work. We'll see.

The NFFC will always have 14 team events and live events. We'll just have to see how we can fit them all in and where they will be going forward. Much has changed already this year and much more will change in the future. But there's little doubt that the 12-team format is the most popular even now with our die-hard customers and we'll go where they tell us to go with the biggest guaranteed prizes. We won't make the same mistakes that others have and wait too long.

Cocktails and Dreams · Post by **Cocktails and Dreams** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:32 am

Greg, I think the bigger key is not necessarily that people disagree with your prize structure that much in relation to that one. The bigger key is that more people simply know about that game than yours due to an extremely large football guys client base that only knows that game exists. Not much to worry about other than chalking it up to a good business partnership over there, which ironically was not even created by those two partners from what I understand. While it would be cool to get that big over here, it is a tremendous amount of staffing and all that other stuff that would go along with that big of a contest. I think your online championship will be just fine, with maybe just the most minor of tweaks.

RoadKing · Post by **RoadKing** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:41 am

I am not sure that if you go the "big carrot" that "your" consumers will be the winners. It is obvious that you have a following that appreciates a reasonable chance of winning. Not to mention that it appears that you are ready to abandon the Classic format. I understand that there are only a couple of hundred Classic entries but those 200 are diehard 14 teamers that you the NFFC created.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:41 am

Originally posted by Cocktails and Dreams:
Greg, I think the bigger key is not necessarily that people disagree with your prize structure that much in relation to that one. The bigger key is that more people simply know about that game than yours due to an extremely large football guys client base that only knows that game exists. Not much to worry about other than chalking it up to a good business partnership over there, which ironically was not even created by those two partners from what I understand. While it would be cool to get that big over here, it is a tremendous amount of staffing and all that other stuff that would go along with that big of a contest. I think your online championship will be just fine, with maybe just the most minor of tweaks. Agreed on all Chad. Hell, we published FootballGuys' magazine for five years and Joe and I would talk about doing this same thing for years. But we were never going to go into a full partnership on a venture like they did, so it made sense for both of them and next year we have an ace in the hole that could work even better for us. Stay tuned.

Agreed. It's all good and we'll keep the high league prizes next year as well and be more aggressive on the final numbers. I knew back in 2008 when we started the $350 price point in the NFBC and then carried it over here it could be a hit with consumers who felt this was their HSFF experience. It grew more than I ever imagined and now we can grow it more too. But the top league prizes will remain and the bigger grand prizes will follow. Thanks for the feedback and all is good here for both contests.

BillyWaz · Post by **BillyWaz** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:42 am

No question it is a lottery, but for $350, I'm not concerned as much about winning my league.

At $1400-$1500 if the league prizes were similar, I would take a contest that had 1/3 of the entries, and 1/3 of the grand prize every time.

Like Chad said, with them partnering with FBG, they have a whole new group to reach out to.

That all being said, I have one more NFFC Online, than I do FPC Championship teams!

I just am cuckoo for KDS and 3RR!!

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:42 am

Originally posted by RoadKing:
I am not sure that if you go the "big carrot" that "your" consumers will be the winners. It is obvious that you have a following that appreciates a reasonable chance of winning. Not to mention that it appears that you are ready to abandon the Classic format. I understand that there are only a couple of hundred Classic entries but those 200 are diehard 14 teamers that you the NFFC created. Nah, we'll never abandon the format. Tweak it and make it better. I could see myself doing exactly what you're saying, increasing the league prizes and cutting down the carrot slightly for the Classic. We'll have the two Main Event format, which I love, the grand prizes just won't be exactly the same.

RedRyder · Post by **RedRyder** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:44 am

I'm sure you don't want to hear this, but since one of my favorite formats is about to take a hit, I'm posting it.

I talked to many folks who sought my opinion as to where to play this year (not just ex-WCOFF). I equally sang the praises of the NFFC and FFPC. I was surprised that about 80% chose your competitor and one of the biggest reasons was KDS & 3RR.

I don't want to insult any of the folks that asked for my recommendations, but I got the feeling they didn't want to invest the time into learning new concepts.

Doesn't matter if you, me and NFFC die-hards like these and know they aren't hard things to grasp. They are NEW concepts to a vast majority of folks. And sometimes people just don't want to sit down and learn something new.

Just sayin'...

Glenneration X · Post by **Glenneration X** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:54 am

Originally posted by Quahogs:
A nice Classic odds thread and no status on Wednesday's Sep 7 contest ? Last I checked there were two teams so far right ? I'm tempted to take team #3 here. (Sep 6 tuesday is the Super so that's a no go). I think you can get the Sep 7 to fill don't you think Greg ? Screw the 7th, let's work hard to get the one on the 6th filled.