Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
quote:Originally posted by GK:
quote:Originally posted by KOTRAX:
I AGREE WITH SNAKE'S POINT 100% WHY AREN'T THERE ANY REPRECAUTIONS WHEN OPERATORS DO THIS?
AT ANY MOMENT ANY "TRUSTED" GAME OPERATOR IN THE PAST CAN SIMPLY WALK AWAY UNSCAVED FROM WHAT IT APPEARS.
WHICH I REALLY BAD FOR THE PLAYERS. WE SHOULDN'T HAVE TO "HOPE" WE ARE GOING TO GET PAID.
ARE BIGGEST CONCERN SHOULD BE DRAFTING RIGHT, MAKING THE RIGHT LINEUP DECISIONS IN ORDER TO GET PAID IN THE END. ...never really knew this as up until now it's either been the NFFC or WCOFF (one year) which SNAKE has participated in and implicitly trusted but if one really stops to ponder here it is rather shocking that there is ZERO, absolute ZERO regulation of any sort to ensure that the winners of High Stakes Fantasy Sports contests get paid their due...if Greg & Co. would like to keep the government regulators out of their business (can't blame them one bit) then the time could be ripe - immediately - for some REAL industry self-regulation...SNAKE [/QUOTE]Well, we started the Fantasy Sports Players Association in 1999 to help police our industry after the Replica Corporation went under without paying off all of their prizes. The FSPA became the FSTA (Fantasy Sports Trade Association) and other issues overtook policing games, which honestly, was a non-issue for many years.
Now even if the FSTA oversaw every pay fantasy game, both AFFL.com and Fantasy Jungle would have received high marks before the 2007 and 2008 seasons, respectively. Both had histories of paying on time, both had little to no issues with customers and both were active members in the industry. Neil, Mike and Scott were trusted.
But something happened to both companies that I certainly didn't see coming. We know how Neil invested the money and only Mike and Scott know what happened last year at FJ. No matter what their answer is, nobody saw this coming and a self-regulating watchdog would be as surprised right now as we all are because there was no previous indication that this would happen.
So we're back to the trust factor and looking at the companies behind these high-stakes contests. Is there enough backing for the game you're playing in to really guarantee the prizes and pay them out on time in good times and in bad times? That's the key right now: Play with contests that have more than a good history. They need the backing to back up their claims. [/QUOTE]GREAT POINTS GREG! HOWEVER WOULDN'T ONE HAVE SAID THAT THE AFFL AND FANTASY JUNGLE HAD MORE THAN A GOOD HISTORY UNTIL WHAT HAPPENEND?
FROM WHAT I KNOW ONLY THE NFFC AND FFOC HAS THE BACKING THAT YOU SPEAK OF.
IF SOMEONE BACKS THE OTHER HIGH-STAKES FANTASY EVENTS I AM NOT AWARE OF WHO THEY ARE.
DOES THIS MEAN WE RUN A HIGHER RISK AS PLAYERS IN PLAYING THESE OTHER EVENTS?
WHO KNOWS?
THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT KNOW ARE THE OPERATORS THEMSELVES AND OF COURSE THEY ARE GOING TO TELL US PLAYERS THAT THERE GAMES ARE ON THE UP AND UP.
OUR HANDS ARE TIED AS PLAYERS AND ALL WE HAVE IS HOPE AND TRUST, NOTHING ELSE.
BUT I CAN SAY UNTIL THIS DAY I WILL CONTINUE TO PLAY IN THE "BIG 3" AND ONLY THE "BIG 3."
Fantasy Jungle STILL HAS NOT PAID?
Fantasy Jungle STILL HAS NOT PAID?
Kotrax,
I think that is a good point - just be careful about which events you play in. I will probably just do the nffc next year because I like the format the best. I played FFPC last year and thought they did a very nice job but I just prefer the 14 team leagues, the kds, and the 3rr. To me it just makes for a better experience.
I just hope this whole problem ends up helping the nffc as opposed to hurting them. The nffc has to be far and away the strongest financial backers of any fantasy football contest by far.
Wayne
I think that is a good point - just be careful about which events you play in. I will probably just do the nffc next year because I like the format the best. I played FFPC last year and thought they did a very nice job but I just prefer the 14 team leagues, the kds, and the 3rr. To me it just makes for a better experience.
I just hope this whole problem ends up helping the nffc as opposed to hurting them. The nffc has to be far and away the strongest financial backers of any fantasy football contest by far.
Wayne
Fantasy Jungle STILL HAS NOT PAID?
I AM HOPING FOR THE SAME THING AS WELL. I WILL INDEED BE EXTREMELY CAREFUL OF WHO I PLAY WITH THIS YEAR.
AS I HOPE THAT EVERYONE DOES. WE ALL NEED TO LOOK MORE CAREFULLY AT WHAT IS GOING ON.
WITH SUCH A BAD ECONOMY MONEY IS THAT MUCH HARDER TO COME BY, BUT EVEN IN A BOOMING ECOMONY NO ONE STILL WANTS TO BE RIPPED OFF.
YEAH I DO ENJOY THE NFFC VERY MUCH I JUST WISHED I WOULD HAVE JOINED THEM BACK IN 2004 BUT BETTER LATE THAN NEVER.
GREG IS A GREATGAME OPERATOR AND I WOULD RECOMMEND THE NFFC/NBC LEAGUES TO ANYONE WITHOUT ANY SKEPTICISM.
[ April 14, 2009, 04:15 PM: Message edited by: KOTRAX ]
AS I HOPE THAT EVERYONE DOES. WE ALL NEED TO LOOK MORE CAREFULLY AT WHAT IS GOING ON.
WITH SUCH A BAD ECONOMY MONEY IS THAT MUCH HARDER TO COME BY, BUT EVEN IN A BOOMING ECOMONY NO ONE STILL WANTS TO BE RIPPED OFF.
YEAH I DO ENJOY THE NFFC VERY MUCH I JUST WISHED I WOULD HAVE JOINED THEM BACK IN 2004 BUT BETTER LATE THAN NEVER.
GREG IS A GREATGAME OPERATOR AND I WOULD RECOMMEND THE NFFC/NBC LEAGUES TO ANYONE WITHOUT ANY SKEPTICISM.
[ April 14, 2009, 04:15 PM: Message edited by: KOTRAX ]
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kevindulin
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:00 pm
Fantasy Jungle STILL HAS NOT PAID?
I was the main event winner in Fantasy Jungle this year. ($50,000 mythical prize). The most frustrating part of the whole process for me is that i tried to be a responsible consumer. I checked everywhere I could to find out about Fantasy Jungle before i signed up. There were no warnings signs anywhere that i could find. They, like other recently failed leagues had a recent history of paying all prize winners, had no complaints with the better business bureau, etc.
The problem i see is that every other league will continue to say, "we are good for it, look at our history". And they will continue to pay out prize, until they don't.
Now, I know there are some good, legit businesses out there, but, even upon some serious investigation, they nearly all look the same. They all promise that they are safe and dependable, they all show a history of payment, just like Fantasy Jungle did.
I will be joining leagues and playing this year, but I completely understand why some would be reluctant.
As far as Fantasy Jungle goes, here is what I have done so far: I made up a packet of as much information as i could find about Fantasy Jungle.
1) A digital copy of their website, in case they take it down.
2) Every press release/advertisement i could find from last summer promising a $50,000 first prize
3) Every email correspondance from them, from the sign-up confirmation to the latest update.
4) Complete league rules, final standings, etc.
5) Complete contact information of the owners, other businesses, other phone numbers, and home addresses.
6) A summary of how much money was collected from what I knew regarding numbers of leagues, etc. I also mentioned that i had a good number of other names and addresses of people owed money as well that i could provide upon request. (But didnt include them, since i didn't have permission to do so).
I sent this packet to 5 different people: 1) The Attorney General of Michigan. (Fantasy jungle's home state) 2) The Attorney General of Missouri (my home state). 3) The Federal Trade Commission (FTC) 4) The Missori F.B.I. Office. 5) My local sheriff's office.
I don't know if any will respond or show any interest, but at least i feel like i am doing something. I know of others thinking about doing the same. And bonus, doesn't cost anything!
If there are any attorney's familiar with this type of case, either civil or criminal who would like to help me and the other winners in some way, please contact me.
I do appreciate this forum and Greg's willingness to let it exist so that others can know of our situation. I love fantasy football, but I hate the way this has all gone down.
My email address for anyone who would like to contact me is [email protected].
The problem i see is that every other league will continue to say, "we are good for it, look at our history". And they will continue to pay out prize, until they don't.
Now, I know there are some good, legit businesses out there, but, even upon some serious investigation, they nearly all look the same. They all promise that they are safe and dependable, they all show a history of payment, just like Fantasy Jungle did.
I will be joining leagues and playing this year, but I completely understand why some would be reluctant.
As far as Fantasy Jungle goes, here is what I have done so far: I made up a packet of as much information as i could find about Fantasy Jungle.
1) A digital copy of their website, in case they take it down.
2) Every press release/advertisement i could find from last summer promising a $50,000 first prize
3) Every email correspondance from them, from the sign-up confirmation to the latest update.
4) Complete league rules, final standings, etc.
5) Complete contact information of the owners, other businesses, other phone numbers, and home addresses.
6) A summary of how much money was collected from what I knew regarding numbers of leagues, etc. I also mentioned that i had a good number of other names and addresses of people owed money as well that i could provide upon request. (But didnt include them, since i didn't have permission to do so).
I sent this packet to 5 different people: 1) The Attorney General of Michigan. (Fantasy jungle's home state) 2) The Attorney General of Missouri (my home state). 3) The Federal Trade Commission (FTC) 4) The Missori F.B.I. Office. 5) My local sheriff's office.
I don't know if any will respond or show any interest, but at least i feel like i am doing something. I know of others thinking about doing the same. And bonus, doesn't cost anything!
If there are any attorney's familiar with this type of case, either civil or criminal who would like to help me and the other winners in some way, please contact me.
I do appreciate this forum and Greg's willingness to let it exist so that others can know of our situation. I love fantasy football, but I hate the way this has all gone down.
My email address for anyone who would like to contact me is [email protected].
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Greg Ambrosius
- Posts: 36413
- Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2004 6:00 pm
Fantasy Jungle STILL HAS NOT PAID?
Kevin, good luck to you and you know I feel bad for you and all of the other FJ winners who haven't been paid yet. Several continue to e-mail me with updates as well. Feel free to post any updates on this situation if/when they occur.
There is no doubt that fantasy players should be concerned with every football contest out there because our industry now has a poor track record over the last two years and nothing is being done about it. But not every contest is the same. We are a CORPORATION where fantasy sports is less than one-half of one percent of our overall business. We are not two guys who created a fantasy contest where all of the revenues come and go from the contest. There's nothing wrong with companies setting up businesses that way, but unfortunately they are totally reliant on 1) those revenues; and 2) being honest.
Again, I know several contests who are currently set up that way that I would trust my own money with. But the one obvious difference with the NFFC is that we are backed by a BIG company whose revenues come from many, many different sources. We aren't dumb enough to spend our prize money on other business ventures and we're big enough to handle downturns in the marketplace. We are a small division in a company that was purchased for $500+ million in 2004.
But enough of us. Do all you can to get your winnings so that you can enjoy an INCREDIBLE accomplishment. Anyone who wins a national contest should enjoy the spoils and get their winnings. I hope somehow you get it. Good luck and keep all of our readers posted on the progress.
There is no doubt that fantasy players should be concerned with every football contest out there because our industry now has a poor track record over the last two years and nothing is being done about it. But not every contest is the same. We are a CORPORATION where fantasy sports is less than one-half of one percent of our overall business. We are not two guys who created a fantasy contest where all of the revenues come and go from the contest. There's nothing wrong with companies setting up businesses that way, but unfortunately they are totally reliant on 1) those revenues; and 2) being honest.
Again, I know several contests who are currently set up that way that I would trust my own money with. But the one obvious difference with the NFFC is that we are backed by a BIG company whose revenues come from many, many different sources. We aren't dumb enough to spend our prize money on other business ventures and we're big enough to handle downturns in the marketplace. We are a small division in a company that was purchased for $500+ million in 2004.
But enough of us. Do all you can to get your winnings so that you can enjoy an INCREDIBLE accomplishment. Anyone who wins a national contest should enjoy the spoils and get their winnings. I hope somehow you get it. Good luck and keep all of our readers posted on the progress.
Founder, National Fantasy Football Championship & National Fantasy Baseball Championship
Twitter: @GregAmbrosius
Twitter: @GregAmbrosius
Fantasy Jungle STILL HAS NOT PAID?
Was deleting a bunch of e-mails, and came across this one dated January 2nd, 2009.....
Just a reminder that the NFL Playoff contest starts tomorrow, as does our contest where someone is going to take home $10,000. It's the biggest playoff contest prize out there.
You may sign up anytime this weekend. To use players for all games, you need to sign up by tomorrow, however you may signup as late as 4 PM on Sunday if you fill your roster with players from the last game of the weekend.
Many options to choose from, no draft required, just pick who you want, kick back, and enjoy the playoffs all the way up until the Super Bowl.
If you have a bad year, now is the time to start over. If you have had a good one, keep the momentun going.
Multiple team discounts availabe. Sign up today at www.fantasyjungle.com
To unsubscribe to this email list, please send an email to [email protected] with subject 'REMOVE ME'
In the bold, it should have read something like...
"If you have had a bad year,we would love to take more of your money! If you have a had a good one, we will take MORE of your money, as we aren't planning on paying ANYONE this year, but would love to try and run another contest!"
Are you telling me these guys had NO CLUE they couldn't pay people from the regular season when they attempted to run ANOTHER contest????
Add in that I sent an e-mail about 3 weeks after inquiring about when $$$ would be sent, and Mike said that checks were going out after the Super Bowl, and he informed accounting.
So he had the opportunity to be HONEST, but chose to be a coward, but wants everyone to believe that it was the economy that caused all this.....yea right buddy!!
I hope these guys get what they deserve.
[ May 02, 2009, 08:39 AM: Message edited by: BillyWaz ]
Just a reminder that the NFL Playoff contest starts tomorrow, as does our contest where someone is going to take home $10,000. It's the biggest playoff contest prize out there.
You may sign up anytime this weekend. To use players for all games, you need to sign up by tomorrow, however you may signup as late as 4 PM on Sunday if you fill your roster with players from the last game of the weekend.
Many options to choose from, no draft required, just pick who you want, kick back, and enjoy the playoffs all the way up until the Super Bowl.
If you have a bad year, now is the time to start over. If you have had a good one, keep the momentun going.
Multiple team discounts availabe. Sign up today at www.fantasyjungle.com
To unsubscribe to this email list, please send an email to [email protected] with subject 'REMOVE ME'
In the bold, it should have read something like...
"If you have had a bad year,we would love to take more of your money! If you have a had a good one, we will take MORE of your money, as we aren't planning on paying ANYONE this year, but would love to try and run another contest!"
Are you telling me these guys had NO CLUE they couldn't pay people from the regular season when they attempted to run ANOTHER contest????
Add in that I sent an e-mail about 3 weeks after inquiring about when $$$ would be sent, and Mike said that checks were going out after the Super Bowl, and he informed accounting.
So he had the opportunity to be HONEST, but chose to be a coward, but wants everyone to believe that it was the economy that caused all this.....yea right buddy!!
I hope these guys get what they deserve.
[ May 02, 2009, 08:39 AM: Message edited by: BillyWaz ]
Fantasy Jungle STILL HAS NOT PAID?
Again sorry to hear that.
'I hope these guys get what they deserve.' They won't and that's the problem.
I have to figure there walking away with around 100,000-150,000K. That's what the killer is.
I may be alittle off but I'm close. If Shawn or Glenn want to try and figure it out, that would be great. But Mike and Scott ARE walking away with money, don't kid yourself.
John
'I hope these guys get what they deserve.' They won't and that's the problem.
I have to figure there walking away with around 100,000-150,000K. That's what the killer is.
I may be alittle off but I'm close. If Shawn or Glenn want to try and figure it out, that would be great. But Mike and Scott ARE walking away with money, don't kid yourself.
John
Fantasy Jungle STILL HAS NOT PAID?
I'm 1 of the "poor souls" who was with these guys from the beginning.I'm owed $6k for winning a hirollers league and have received a few emails from Mike,while Scott has been hiding behind his other businesses.I'm 1 of those that love fantasy but do not think I will ever trust anyone enough again to pay in my hardearned$$.The 1 thing Greg,you can do is publicize this as much as possible so that Mike/Scott cannot hide.We might not get our $$ bur at least let them be known for what they are.These guys should never show their faces in public.
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Glenneration X
- Posts: 1704
- Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:00 pm
- Location: Long Island, NY
Fantasy Jungle STILL HAS NOT PAID?
Originally posted by BillyWaz:
Was deleting a bunch of e-mails, and came across this one dated January 2nd, 2009.....
Just a reminder that the NFL Playoff contest starts tomorrow, as does our contest where someone is going to take home $10,000. It's the biggest playoff contest prize out there.
You may sign up anytime this weekend. To use players for all games, you need to sign up by tomorrow, however you may signup as late as 4 PM on Sunday if you fill your roster with players from the last game of the weekend.
Many options to choose from, no draft required, just pick who you want, kick back, and enjoy the playoffs all the way up until the Super Bowl.
If you have a bad year, now is the time to start over. If you have had a good one, keep the momentun going.
Multiple team discounts availabe. Sign up today at www.fantasyjungle.com
To unsubscribe to this email list, please send an email to [email protected] with subject 'REMOVE ME'
In the bold, it should have read something like...
"If you have had a bad year,we would love to take more of your money! If you have a had a good one, we will take MORE of your money, as we aren't planning on paying ANYONE this year, but would love to try and run another contest!"
Are you telling me these guys had NO CLUE they couldn't pay people from the regular season when they attempted to run ANOTHER contest????
Add in that I sent an e-mail about 3 weeks after inquiring about when $$$ would be sent, and Mike said that checks were going out after the Super Bowl, and he informed accounting.
So he had the opportunity to be HONEST, but chose to be a coward, but wants everyone to believe that it was the economy that caused all this.....yea right buddy!!
I hope these guys get what they deserve. Fantasy Jungle was also promoting their baseball contest months after defaulting on the football winners. I wonder how many poor souls who did not do their research sent them money for baseball....talk about dead money.
Was deleting a bunch of e-mails, and came across this one dated January 2nd, 2009.....
Just a reminder that the NFL Playoff contest starts tomorrow, as does our contest where someone is going to take home $10,000. It's the biggest playoff contest prize out there.
You may sign up anytime this weekend. To use players for all games, you need to sign up by tomorrow, however you may signup as late as 4 PM on Sunday if you fill your roster with players from the last game of the weekend.
Many options to choose from, no draft required, just pick who you want, kick back, and enjoy the playoffs all the way up until the Super Bowl.
If you have a bad year, now is the time to start over. If you have had a good one, keep the momentun going.
Multiple team discounts availabe. Sign up today at www.fantasyjungle.com
To unsubscribe to this email list, please send an email to [email protected] with subject 'REMOVE ME'
In the bold, it should have read something like...
"If you have had a bad year,we would love to take more of your money! If you have a had a good one, we will take MORE of your money, as we aren't planning on paying ANYONE this year, but would love to try and run another contest!"
Are you telling me these guys had NO CLUE they couldn't pay people from the regular season when they attempted to run ANOTHER contest????
Add in that I sent an e-mail about 3 weeks after inquiring about when $$$ would be sent, and Mike said that checks were going out after the Super Bowl, and he informed accounting.
So he had the opportunity to be HONEST, but chose to be a coward, but wants everyone to believe that it was the economy that caused all this.....yea right buddy!!
I hope these guys get what they deserve. Fantasy Jungle was also promoting their baseball contest months after defaulting on the football winners. I wonder how many poor souls who did not do their research sent them money for baseball....talk about dead money.