What Is Going To Happen To High-Stakes Fantasy Football?

[Greg Ambrosius]

Thanks Scott. Keep everyone on top of the situation if you can because many NFFC owners are waiting for these prize payments before they can make plans for 2011. Hopefully a response will be coming soon.

[BillyWaz]

Originally posted by FPA - Scott Atkins:

Scott -

Respectfully, the World Championship of Fantasy Football will not be responding to demands from any association. It has, and will continue to, respond in a manner as deemed appropriate by company counsel to the players who are currently awaiting the awards process to resume as we work through a transaction involving ownership of the World Championship of Fantasy Sports.

Best Regards,

Dustin Ashby
World Championship of Fantasy Sports
623 Timber Creek Trail
O'Fallon, MO 63368
636-728-1118 (Office)
http://www.wcofs.com

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
"It has, and will continue to, respond in a manner as deemed appropriate by company counsel to the players who are currently awaiting the awards process to resume"

Yea, that is why numerous people have said on their boards that they have called and emailed repeatedly and heard NOTHING back!

The only thing worse than an incompetent fool is a BLATANT LIAR!

I felt bad for WCOFF at first, but the way they have handled this whole situation......they don't deserve to continue IMO.

Hope all those still awaiting $$$$ get it VERY soon.

[ June 17, 2011, 10:25 AM: Message edited by: BillyWaz ]

[thegambler]

Originally posted by BillyWaz:
I felt bad for WCOFF at first, but the way they have handled this whole situation......they don't deserve to continue IMO.

Hope all those still awaiting $$$$ get it VERY soon. billy, that is exactly how i felt in the beginning, especially after talking to dustin. i felt like i had to defend them.....not anymore. what they are doing is total bull ****.

i still hope everyone gets their money including stupid people like me that rolled money over.

[Ted's Cracked Head]

What Is Going To Happen To High-Stakes Fantasy Football?

I think that the High Stakes Fantasy Sports Players are in great hands moving forward.

Forget the WCOFF.

I posted the following on FB:

So I'm in a Slow Draft in an NFFC League and we are nearing the end of round 6. Just thought I would give you all some fantasy football to think about since the NFL and NFLPA are close to getting a deal done. Yes, I fully believe we will have an agreement in place in the next 3 weeks.

I might just add that this draft is loaded with heavy hitters in the High Stakes Fantasy Football Arena. It is fun to be drafting with a group like this. If any of you are getting the FF itch, I suggest you consider two places to play this year:

1) NFFC www.nffc.stats.com
2) FFPC www.myffpc.com

Both of these challenges offer everything a fantasy football player needs:

-- They both will pay out and have proven track records in doing so. There are numerous sites out there that are not paying their winners and leaving players high and dry. Some of these sites have failed to pay winners from last years games and are currently accepting cash for this years games? It is buyer beware out there but I can assure all of you that the two sites I have listed above WILL payout quickly after the completion of each game.

-- Both of these sites offer amazing customer service. They both believe in putting the needs of the customers first while maintaining the highest level of integrity. Issues are addressed promptly and head on. Resolutions are just and always with the good of all concerned in mind.

-- Both of these sites offer a wide variety of concepts as well as price points. They offer a challenge for any level player.

-- Both of these sites maintain a good level of discussion on their message boards surrounding their games as well as topics concerning news or even health issues....have fun and get involved.

-- Each of these sites excel at delivering a great Live Draft Experience just in case you are considering entering into the High Stakes market. Pick a city and expect to have a great time run by skilled and friendly facilitators.

If you are ready for a little Fantasy Football action, head over to one or both of these sites, you will not be disappointed. To add to that, both of these challenges are run by individuals who are applying a sound business model while working as hard as they can to enhance the experience for their players. The margin is small yet they work hard to deliver top shelf experiences. Reward them and help spread the word.

All in all and though there have been several companies who have defrauded players out of money, I think the HS Players should be happy about the state of their hobby. They have two options that are rock solid. What more could they ask for?

[Greg Ambrosius]

I'm seeing a lot of deleted posts today on another message board. I can understand the concern when your members are asking for input about other contests they may want to play in on your boards if you plan on returning this year, but any type of positive response about payments going out to unpaid members would easily keep those players from asking about the competitors. Communication from the game operators is likely the best answer here, not deleted posts.

Anyway, at least folks are watching the responses there and taking some form of action. Good or bad, there's movement. Let's see if it leads to folks getting paid soon.

[Greg Ambrosius]

I didn't really know where to put this info, but I thought some of you would be interested in this survey from the Fantasy Sports Trade Association. According to the Ipsos numbers -- which have been commissioned each year by the FSTA since 2004 -- the number of fantasy participants continues to grow. The number of players in the US and Canada now top 32 million. Here's the info, if you're interested:

Fantasy sports participation has grown over 60 percent the past four years as over 32 million people now actively playing in the U.S. and Canada, new research conducted by Ipsos for the Fantasy Sports Trade Association (FSTA) shows. This finding shows the highest participation numbers in the history of fantasy sports. One in five males played fantasy sports in the last year.

“The fantasy sport industry continues to grow at a strong rate even through tough economic times,” said FSTA President Paul Charchian. “The combination of great passion for the hobby and inexpensive participation has made fantasy sports very recession resilient. We’re delighted to see participation numbers continue to grow.”

Overall, the survey shows that United States’ participation in fantasy sports has increased from those that played in 2010 (11%) while Canada’s participation is down slightly from 2010 (14%). As is usually the case, in the United States and Canada more males (19% and 20%, respectively) than females (8% and 5%, respectively) have participated in fantasy sports in the past year.

[thegambler]

not sure if anyone has seen what shawn put on the wcoff boards yesterday. shawn i hope you are cool with me posting it here:

"I am making this post on behalf of Dustin.

I know many of you would like to hear from him, but he isn't in position to respond to the message boards. I know the disappointment and resentment toward him and the WCOFF during this tough time regarding payments. Over the last couple of months, he's done his best to insure the WCOFF moves in another direction and carry the flag as the leader in the fantasy football industry. I know many feel there isn't a transaction going to happen, but that isn't the truth. I think all parties understand the importance of finalizing the deal before the collective bargaining agreement is signed. The goal is to have the deal in place shortly and all players to paid following the transaction.

As for the boards, they aren't a promotional device for other events. If someone is making a malicious post which isn't true, the posts have been removed. If a poster has been suspended or removed from these boards, their post aren't welcomed as some have tried to sign up under another moniker. If they posted after suspension, all post were removed.

Dustin had surgery on Tuesday to remove stage three cancer of the lymph nodes from the right side of his body. After the surgery, he was downgraded to stage four cancer. Over the next couple of months, he will need to heal before starting chemo treatments. He's facing a battle most of us hope we never cross.

I spoken to him today and he was good spirits. As bad as his and the WCOFF situation looks, he is still focused on the future of fantasy football here. His fate lies in the lawyers hands until the deal is complete. Jill is working behind the scene providing any support to help finalize the deal.

Once a deal is complete, Dustin will provide an update on the timeline since February 15 to help players understand what happened here."

[Greg Ambrosius]

Originally posted by thegambler:
not sure if anyone has seen what shawn put on the wcoff boards yesterday. shawn i hope you are cool with me posting it here:

"I am making this post on behalf of Dustin.

I know many of you would like to hear from him, but he isn't in position to respond to the message boards. I know the disappointment and resentment toward him and the WCOFF during this tough time regarding payments. Over the last couple of months, he's done his best to insure the WCOFF moves in another direction and carry the flag as the leader in the fantasy football industry. I know many feel there isn't a transaction going to happen, but that isn't the truth. I think all parties understand the importance of finalizing the deal before the collective bargaining agreement is signed. The goal is to have the deal in place shortly and all players to paid following the transaction.

As for the boards, they aren't a promotional device for other events. If someone is making a malicious post which isn't true, the posts have been removed. If a poster has been suspended or removed from these boards, their post aren't welcomed as some have tried to sign up under another moniker. If they posted after suspension, all post were removed.

Dustin had surgery on Tuesday to remove stage three cancer of the lymph nodes from the right side of his body. After the surgery, he was downgraded to stage four cancer. Over the next couple of months, he will need to heal before starting chemo treatments. He's facing a battle most of us hope we never cross.

I spoken to him today and he was good spirits. As bad as his and the WCOFF situation looks, he is still focused on the future of fantasy football here. His fate lies in the lawyers hands until the deal is complete. Jill is working behind the scene providing any support to help finalize the deal.

Once a deal is complete, Dustin will provide an update on the timeline since February 15 to help players understand what happened here." On behalf of everyone involved in the NFFC, we wish Dustin a speedy recovery and a return to good health. We know he faces a tough battle, but hopefully the good Lord will guide him through this and clean his body of this cancer. I didn't realize he had surgery previously for melanoma and it's unfortunate that it has returned. Best of luck Dustin.

The fantasy sports business community is a tight group with a lot of very good people. I doubt that many in our industry realize that Dustin is fighting this fight. Everyone in our industry is now pulling for his recovery and hoping for the best.

Hopefully throughout this Dustin can communicate what is happening with the WCOFF because a lot of players are still counting on him to pay out last year's prizes. There has to be some kind of communication with the latest facts that Dustin or Shawn or John or someone else can provide. Even during these tough personal times, someone has to be accountable to the members who also supported the WCOFF through good times and in bad. The trust has to continue both ways and I have a feeling news will be coming soon from the WCOFF. They owe that much to the players.

All of our prayers are with Dustin and his family. Hopefully all of this will turn out positively, for Dustin and the WCOFF players.

[Greg Ambrosius]

I also want to add here that I hope our high-stakes space grows up a bit throughout all of this. It's almost as if we've become a very immature part of this industry. I know that sounds harsh, but nowhere else in the fantasy football community -- yes, this seems to be more limited to football -- do you see game operators or their customers continue to take shots at other products. There's almost this mentality of back-stabbing the competition to gain more market share because this area of the market is so limited. I hate that and it seems to grow even more and more here each year.

During my entire 22 years in this industry I've been of the mindset that we need to GROW THE MARKET, not worry about our own market share. During my entire time with the FSA and FSTA we had rival companies doing everything they could to grow the pie, not steal market share from each other. We had ESPN, Sportsline, STATS, The Sporting News, SI.com, MLBPA, NFLPA and some of the other big companies in the industry sharing information to help grow the pie. Never did you see those companies having open forums to rip each other or have their managers stating in the press how bad the competition is. And within the rest of the fantasy football space, you don't have rival commissioner products ripping each other or salary cap games ripping their rivals. Only in this space do you see the rhetoric that we get and can even read from posts like I'm reading from as recent as last night.

Here's what I'd tell folks who now are deciding where to spend their money to thankfully stay in this industry and stay in HSFF: Do your homework with each contest and play in as many as you can afford from a financial side and an enjoyment side. Hey, if you like the NFFC rules and can afford our contests and can make our draft dates -- and you feel safe knowing that you'll get paid at season's end -- then join the NFFC. If you like the FFPC and like their game format and like their draft dates and know you'll get paid, then join them too. If the WCOFF returns and you like everything there and feel safe under the new management, play there too. I want people to play in as many games as possible because the goal is to have all of us grow this pie, not just kill each other over the remaining customers.

There are times I'm just taken aback from some posts in this space. Build up your own product if you'd like, but to continually rip the WCOFF or the NFFC does nobody any good. Now we get to read that the NFFC doesn't have the longest same ownership group in this space!! Whoo-hoo!!!! I'd say that everyone knows that Tom and I have been around for every step of the way since we unveiled the NFBC in November of 2003 and we've been here through all the good times and bad, doing all we could for the players. And everyone has been paid in full and on time -- although admittedly Fanball paid in late February to NFFC owners last year -- and we are in great shape under STATS now. We like our situation, but we have no problem telling folks to check out the FFPC, either. Heck, for that matter check out CDM Fantasy Sports for salary cap games and RT Sports for some online games, too. Who else do you want me to endorse? Oh yeah, use Rotoworld's Draft Kit and Bloomberg's draft software, too. I want this space to expand, not be happy with any contraction we may be witnessing.

I'm off my soapbox now. I'm just shocked at times on how immature all of us can become in this space. I've said this many times, our industry reminds me of the sports card industry 15 years back. That industry bloomed from 1980 to 1993, growing to a $1.6 billion industry. But then greed took over in tough times from all levels of the industry and now that industry is lower than it's been in 30 years. I'd hate to see our industry peak now and find out that greed killed this space. It definitely could happen and I won't be part of that history. I think we know how to grow this industry and this part of the industry can grow without greed and back-stabbing customers and game operators.

To go back to the question of this thread: What Is Going To Happen To High-Stakes Fantasy Football?, I'll say this: It's going to continue to grow and prosper. It may have a major change ahead of us, but it will continue to grow and prosper. And those left standing will run things right and learn from our past lessons, which are many. And for any new games entering this space, it's customer beware going forward. That's just how it has to be for any business now in this space without a track record. Trust is going to be key going forward, no doubt about it.

I recommend many contests in 2012. Yes, I'll recommend ours first and defend our business background to anyone. We are set up perfectly under STATS now. But we're not the only good contest around and if we want this space to grow we'll continue to promote all of the great contests and products and businessmen in our industry. Trust me, most of this industry works this way and hopefully HSFF will work that way one day, too.

[Greg Ambrosius]

I'd also like to add that anyone who has questioned Dustin's health openly is incredibly insensitive and immature to the facts. This is a very serious illness that Dustin has and it's life threatening to someone many of us know well. Say what you want about the current situation with the WCOFF and the lack of communication to players now, but don't question the man's health.

I've heard from some people who are familiar with his situation that he was diagnosed with melanoma more than a year ago and had surgery. He was confident that this was taken care of, but of course you can never know with cancer. I was not aware that it had resurfaced before Shawn's post and obviously with this latest surgery Dustin now has more on his plate than anyone knew. That doesn't mean that someone else within the WCOFF can't continue to find a solution here because Dustin is not the only one working there, but to question his health isn't right. He definitely is sick now and we need to support him in his recovery.

But someone else definitely needs to step up and make the WCOFF players whole and very soon. Or at the very least, honestly tell them what is going on so that they also can move on with their fantasy plans.