NFFC Plans For 2009: Provide Some Feedback

Route Collectors · Post by **Route Collectors** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 1:28 pm

A thought on prize money and the post season:

I'd love to see the league winners only see an increase in 1st place $$$ and make the grand prize like a progressive jackpot each year based on entries.

Let's face it...we all admit that weeks 14-16 are a crapshoot at best. There are alot of good teams and the most fortunate ones always win the
$$$.
Josh had the only team to ever lead the overall standings after 13 weeks and go on to win the playoff championship.

I know this idea will be met with some resistance and I'm OK with that but can we at least talk about why we feel the way we do individually rather than trying to predict how the "masses" will react.

What if we scrap the consolation round and make the playoffs a 308 team shootout. Top teams will already be getting rewarded with league prizes and the dynamics of regular season vs. playoffs are such polar opposites anyway why not?

We could use consolation $$$$ to pay out 4 more entries to the next seasons event and save a few bucks toward the grand prize.

Could we get 1st place league $$$ up to $8000 while still maintaining a 50K guarantee with 308 teams? If not...what could be offered as a grand prize with that type of league payout.

Alot to discuss here....and this IS really just a discussion. I want everyone reading to know I'm just having a conversation like I would on the phone. Not trying to make drastic changes in this post...just presenting a few new ideas.

Your turn!

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 1:31 pm

Originally posted by Diesel:
There are SO many more Main Event players, than Auction players. I think the opinions of some of us have been overlooked, on the issue of an Auction Champ Reward.

I'm not expecting the NFFC to run an Auction Championship, but I do think it would be VERY easy for each team that enters an auction (at ANY price level), if they want to pay an extra $50-$100 to be entered into the Auction Champ Bonus prize. The Team with the most starting points, after week 16, wins this bonus prize. Even if you didn't make the playoffs, you'd be setting your lineup all the way through week 16 to try to win that bonus.

? Marc, I don't have any problem with this concept that Weber has been pushing as long as it's not a mandatory fee to go towards the overall prize. It's hard enough to fill up auction leagues without an additional $50-$100 fee for an overall prize. But if owners want to do this, I'll pay back 100% of that and we'll manually add the overall point totals separately through Week 16 if needed. Breakdown of prizes would depend upon the number of entries, but this is all doable.

CC's Desperados · Post by **CC's Desperados** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 1:39 pm

Originally posted by Diesel:
There are 3 cities. The NFFC offers NBC and NFFC Auction now, so there are 2 auctions at $650 in each city. Then there is the possibility that a $1300 or 2 league will fill. In either case, I was stating that I wasn't shooting for the $5,000 that you put out there.

And even though the NFFC said they were done with online auctions last year, I know of at least 3-4 that were drafted. I moderated one. As I did the year before. I might have even moderated two this past summer. I can't remember what I had for breakfast, so I'm not sure how many, but they were there.

But I get it Shawn. You're against the Auction Bonus. I know of a few people that were interested in having this happen, and maybe we'll just have to do it on the side, if there really is no interest. I'm not against it. I just don't see the market you do. I've played in auction every year in baseball and football. There is interest, but they are mostly the same people every year.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 1:42 pm

Originally posted by Route C:
quote:Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
Okay, I've decided to hold off a bit in announcing our 2009 NFFC plans because I want to get as much feedback from our members as possible. This past year we based our guaranteed prizes on 390 teams for each main event at $1300 per team and we finished with 308 teams in the NFFC Classic and 252 teams in the NFFC Primetime. It would be foolish to shoot for 390 teams again next year and thus something will have to change.

Here's where I want your feedback and let's have some honest debate here and then I'll finalize everything towards the end of January. I already know which way I'm leaning, but I need a push to make it final.

1. Should we keep both main event structures with the 14-team NFFC Classic and 12-team NFFC Primetime? And should we keep the $1 million bonus for winning both main events as the carrot that makes playing both appealing?

Personally, I LOVED the doubleheaders on Draft Day and there's no question that the two differing contests are the way to go. Greg....are you sure you can feel this strongly after only one year. I'm not so sure offering 2 contests won't stifle the growth of the 14 team event.

In the past everyone who participated in the NFFC did so because of the appeal/challenge of the 14 team leagues.
Even owners that got on this MB proclaiming how much better 12 teamers were continued to play year after year LOL.

I wonder now if given the choice going forward if it's possible to grow the 14 team event. could it actually cause the 14 team event to go backwards? I'm not sure one way or the other but it's certainly a possibility and worth pondering.

I just believe the 14 teamer is your bread and butter and should be preserved at all costs. I know 3RR and KDS is great too...but the 14 team event is the backbone. Not saying to ditch 12 team event...just don't forget your niche! [/QUOTE]I agree Jeff that our 14-team format is our backbone, but it's obvious now after five years that our growth potential under that format is limited. It's not the most common format and I think we all know that. Those of you who play in it realize that it is the ultimate competition, but it's not the easiest format to win at and for that reason the 12-team Primetime format could possibly outgrow the Classic format. I'm not willing to lose money each year just to preserve our unique format.

I think providing the doubleheader is the way to go as once the travel costs are already figured in some folks would love to draft as much as possible against our great competitors. Mark Moyer said it best this year in Las Vegas when he said that if we said we'd run some $250 and $500 satellite leagues inbetween both main events we'd probably fill 3-4 on the spot. Same with after the Primetime main event out there.

But I know what you're saying: Maybe we are taking from one to grow the other. The key is to find levels that sell out both and then continue to grow both events from there. I shot too high with my estimates in 2004 and struggled to reach that goal the next four years and last year I overshot again with both main events. I need to figure this out for the best of all of us or our niche will be short-lived and I'll be writing obituaries for the Iola Herald.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 1:52 pm

Originally posted by Route C:
Could we get 1st place league $$$ up to $8000 while still maintaining a 50K guarantee with 308 teams? If not...what could be offered as a grand prize with that type of league payout.
Jeff, right now with a guarantee of 390 teams, I have $140,000 set aside for overall prizes, including the consolation round. Based on 308 teams, the guarantee would be just over $110,000 in available overall prizes. Remember, legally I need to guarantee these prizes before we announce the contest and stick to them and thus it's important each year for me to forecast the number of teams I believe we'll get and make it work. We've been incredibly successful at this in baseball, but we've fallen short each year except 2007 in football. So take a look at the $110,000 with league prizes at the same level as 2008 and realize what I'm working with right now.

If demand brings us back above 308, everyone knows I'll pay it back at the same percentage (75%) to the overall prize pool. So we both benefit by not only reaching our guaranteed prize level but going slightly above it. If we guarantee $75,000 for first, for instance, that leaves us with $35,000 for all the other overall prizes.

I appreciate everyone doing the math with me and understanding what needs to be done to still make this work and grow what we love. It's not easy for me, trust me, but this tough economy is making reality set in big-time this year and we need a better year than 2008 was for us. That's just reality unless something big happens that isn't currently on the horizon.

pizzatyme · Post by **pizzatyme** » Thu Jan 01, 2009 6:48 am

Originally posted by Greg Ambrosius:
I'm not willing to lose money each year just to preserve our unique format.
Maybe I've missed you saying this before Greg, but I really appreciate you clarifying for me. I think everyone needs to consider this statement when making suggestions.

As for added prize money being paid back at 100%, I love that and it too is much appreciated. I would ask that you offer this for any of your live weekend events. I'd love to add some money for a "Top Dog" prize for the DC and Auction total points winner.

As to Marc's comments about online auctions, I also ran one of these and it went off without any issues. These can and will work if everyone just follows Marc's prescribed directions.

Thanks for asking for input!

pizzatyme · Post by **pizzatyme** » Thu Jan 01, 2009 6:51 am

I'd also add that I think there would have been MANY more auction leagues if there was some level of comfort from Greg on these going off without issues. I'm all for Marc doing these for a small Auctioneer fee of $50 or so.

boutrous11 · Post by **boutrous11** » Thu Jan 01, 2009 8:02 am

I'll be using my $650 credit on some sort of auction, most likely. i love them. most likely in Chicago, unless you bring a draft to Detroit LOL! i love the idea of an additional $100 for an overall auction champion, and i appreciate the offer of 100% payout on that bonus Greg.

TURBOUGH · Post by **TURBOUGH** » Thu Jan 01, 2009 10:42 am

I think the more the entry fee is, the higher percentage payout should be. You're still making your money on all leagues.

I've always said, why get in a league that pays out 80% and pay taxes. It really doesn't make sense. When I enter a $1300 league, I'm paying $260 just to participate. Why be like the other leagues? Set yourself apart from the others and raise the percentages. Other sites earned my business because of this. JMO. Not trying to **** anyone off here.

Eddiejag · Post by **Eddiejag** » Thu Jan 01, 2009 11:31 am

Shawn the auction KILLER, he he he .
Doesnt Wcoff run an auction event that pay's the highest auction team a bonus and the glory of King Auction.How much was that one and how many teams are in it.Maybe we can do something like wcoff's but just not as many teams.Who's got the info on there auction leagues.