Skeptical Draft Order

BLACKHAND · Post by **BLACKHAND** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 2:57 pm

SOUR GRAPES BLUE_FOOT. just step back and think of what you said.

#1- a top three or four spot does not give you a lock to win.
#2-you still have to beat many players in the playoffs.
#3-do you really think splitting 100k is worth it to tom and greg(answer:no)
#4- if you REALLY think this is fixed and put your money up next year , i just want to invite you to a $5,000 league i an starting next year. there are 20 teams per league and i will pick draft spots. (lol)

lichtman · Post by **lichtman** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 2:09 pm

I think Blue_Foot is on to something. I was able to pay my way into pick #4 in my league.

All it cost me was a cool $1250.

And just to show how smooth Greg and Tom are, I hear that the guy who got pcik 14 paid the same amount! Sucker!

Sack · Post by **Sack** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 8:07 am

Blue-Foot, as one of THE GOOD-OLE BOYS, mainly because I was on the bandwagon with support for the NFFC/NFBC since day #1 (literally) I had the #5 spot in the Main and my wife had the #8 spot.

In the Draft Champions, I selected #2.

If you really have issues with your draft slot but enjoy your first year playing, I suggest joining an AUCTION LEAGUE next fall. There, you'll lose your last excuse.

[ September 04, 2006, 02:08 PM: Message edited by: Sack ]

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 8:31 am

Okay, it's my turn to address this post.

I don't have any problem with someone questioning his pick out of the hat and wondering about the odds in getting a poor draft spot. That happens all the time. But as I told this owner when he confronted me at the end of the Las Vegas draft, questioning my integrity and accusing me of possibly fixing some draft spots for certain owners is out of line. We have nothing to gain by having certain owners get their favorite draft spots and others getting their worst spots.

What I did tell him in Las Vegas is that there are some owners who agree with him on the concept of picking the draft slots live just before the draft. Some guys would love the thrill of that and this owner is one of them. Hell, Tom and I would probably love that as it would take all the work out of our hands the week before. Unfortunately, I think less than 2 percent of all NFFC owners would like to do it this way as most owners want their draft spots as soon as possible so that they can get their game plans in order. So if a small minority want a rule change as drastic as this one which this owner is proposing, as the caretaker of the event I can't do it just to appease him. Sorry, it's a fun idea, but it just wouldn't work for us and logistically it would be a nightmare.

Now as far as his draft spot is concerned, let's go over the facts first.

1. In Las Vegas, we threw 98 names into a hat to form seven leagues. This owner was in league 5, which means that 56 names were pulled from the hat before we got to his league. Josh Ferenc, our defending champion, got the No. 1 pick in LV 5, which means he was the 57th name pulled out of the hat because No. 1 was his first KDS preference. Had he been the 56th name pulled out of the hat by Tom, he would have gotten pick No. 14 (depending on KDS) in LV 4 rather than the first pick in LV 5. That's the luck of the draw sometimes.

2. The owner in question was picked 12th out of the hat, or 68th overall in Las Vegas. Those things happen. He didn't get his last preference as he said to me originally. The odds of him getting his 12th preference are low, but as a scientist he knows there is that possibility. He didn't get this 13th preference or his 14th preference, he got his 12th preference. It's statistically possible to get that preference, correct?

3. At some point you just have to trust someone and that's what I tried to tell him. Believe me, when I tried to convince folks to pay us $1,250 to join the NFFC in 2004, they had to trust that I was legitimate, that I wasn't going to take their money and run and they had to trust that we'd guarantee the prize money if we didn't reach our goals. For three straight years, we have not hit our goal of 350 teams in the main event, yet for three straight years I've guaranteed the prize pool. I don't pro-rate it based on the number of entries, I ate the losses. This year we should have had an additional $35,000 in revenue if we had reached 350 teams instead of 322 teams, but we didn't get there so I lost out on the additional $19,000 in revenue ($8,000 per league would have gone out in league prizes). My bad, but you shouldn't worry about that.

Again, at some point you just have to trust other people. Tom and I aren't going to cheat you out of your credit card. Krause Publications has been in business for 54 years, so we're obviously a creditable company. The event in baseball and football has paid out over $1 million in prize money since 2004, so we obviously have a track record. I have 17 years in this industry and am well known as a leader in the industry, so why would I fix the draft spots? Do you think I'm willing to throw all that hard work out the window so that Josh gets his favored draft spot?

4. As for FAAB bids, Tom and I don't even see those before they are processed. Everything is done through STATS' back-end support and then they release the winning bids. Every owner gets to see the price of the winning bid and the runnerup bid, so how could we ever fix anything? If you bid higher and we gave the free agent to the wrong team, I think we'd hear about it on the message boards, right? The contest would lose its credibility in a New York minute if we did that.

The debate is over. I heard the owner's complaint and listened to his desire to pick names live right there. I agreed that maybe one day we'd pick them live via an Internet broadcast. That would be cool. But for now, he needs to trust that we picked the draft spots fairly and honestly and move on. When we do something that isn't honest, then let me know. For now, we've been on the up-and-up with everything we've done this year and last year and the year before that.

Good luck to this owner and everyone else in the contest. No draft spot is guaranteed to win the $100,000 this year, that's a given. So good luck to one and all.

FRISHMAN · Post by **FRISHMAN** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 8:55 am

I, for one don't think there is any kind of integrity issue. But Greg, I do think you need to a live draw for positions. For one, there would be no question by anybody, no bad blood, no hard feelings...you eliminate that. Secondly, it saves you hours of needless work. I think we should take a poll of who would rather have a live draw for numbers and who wouldn't. It's similiar to trades though, to keep it completely free from any question of integrity you have to eliminate them. The same should be done for the drafting spots. That's my take.

ultimatefs · Post by **ultimatefs** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 9:07 am

This is suppose to be the best of the best.

You should be able to draft from any position and win.

In the WSOP, do they get to choose where they sit?

A TRUER test of who is the best would be to walk in and get your spot right before the draft.

I bet Gekko would not oversleep

One bucket for league assignment.

Another for your pick.

Greg Ambrosius · Post by **Greg Ambrosius** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 9:09 am

Originally posted by STEELERS DRV 4 5:
I, for one don't think there is any kind of integrity issue. But Greg, I do think you need to a live draw for positions. For one, there would be no question by anybody, no bad blood, no hard feelings...you eliminate that. Secondly, it saves you hours of needless work. I think we should take a poll of who would rather have a live draw for numbers and who wouldn't. It's similiar to trades though, to keep it completely free from any question of integrity you have to eliminate them. The same should be done for the drafting spots. That's my take. I would have no problem taking a poll on this subject. I think I know what the results would be, but I'll gladly create a poll to verify that.

The reason for doing picks live at the event wouldn't be an integrity issue, it would be done because the VAST majority of owners want this. That's why I'd do it. The draft spots are picked on the up-and-up and we have a whole office of employees around Tom and I to verify how they were picked. We're not two guys in a garage doing this. But again, I'll gladly ask the masses and see what they say about this issue.

kjduke · Post by **kjduke** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 9:56 am

Forget about draft-day slot picks. An overwhelming majority, as Greg said, want to plan their strategy in advance. Doing a poll on this is a waste of time, which I think even its proponents should know. George Bush would have a better chance of winning chairman of the teamster's union.

However, an internet broadcast - or maybe even a chat-room broadcast if video isn't feasible, would be a lot of fun !!

[ September 05, 2006, 04:00 PM: Message edited by: KJ Duke ]

dobberlins · Post by **dobberlins** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 9:57 am

Greg,

I'm fine with things as they are. I do think however, there is one thing missing...no one seems to mention it in their posts...you don't need the #1 pick to win your league! Unless I'm missing something, I think most winners will have great mid-late round picks. Look at Gekko, he won $100,000 picking 13th. (And he doesn't know anything about football

) Just kidding Gekko!

But in all honesty, I kind of would like to see how many league winners had the number 1 pick when the season is done. I could be wrong, but to me, it is't the be all and end all.

Greg - best way to fix this...have auction leagues. (Keep the Johnnie Walker Blue Label out of the NY draft rooms though!)

FRISHMAN · Post by **FRISHMAN** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 11:14 am

I was involved in another high stakes Vegas league a few years back (been with NFFC for 3 years now) and there was no problem with picking the draft slots the day of. It took an additional 15 minutes...maybe. Your draft strategy should be done on all 14 slots prior to the draft, it's not that difficult. As it is now, your strategy is usually gone anyway because someone selects "joe blow" for the ninth pick right before your tenth pick. Think of the added intrigue of not knowing where you are selecting. It's almost a little deflating when you arrive at the draft, with that out of the bag. Personally, I think it would definately add suspense and butterflies to the event (which by the way is very good already). Again, it doesn't totally matter where you pick...I get that, but it does have an added weight or else what would be the need for the KDS?