QB points

[Coltsfan]

Wil,

There is no right or wrong here are many people have lots of personal preferences for different scoring options. You like 6 points - awesome! That's your preference.

But I think that what some are saying here comes down to a couple different things.

1. The system the NFFC uses is heavily weighted towards QB. The scoring by our QB can easily by one fourth to one third of your team points depending on how the rest of your team scores. (I realize QB's don't average this much but it's somewhat common.) I'll give examples

Cam Newton - most would consider Cam a decent fantasy QB. His low score this year is 7.95 and his high is 39.1. That is better than a 31 point swing.

Matthew Stafford - worst 8.45 and best 35.85 for a 27 point swing.

Aaron Rodgers - a definite fantasy starter when healthy. Worst score in games he completed 16.6 and best is 47.7. I 31 point swing.

What I'm saying by all of this is that if your stud QB lays an egg while the other guys QB has a good game then it might be hard to make up 30 points elsewhere. I realize that these variances can happen at any position but they are FAR more likely to happen at QB in the NFFC scoring. In fact, this last off season the NFFC changed its scoring system to -2 points per interception and this slight change actually makes the scoring difference even worst. (I know that wasn't the intention but that is the result.)

For me, I don't really care that much. Most of what I do is DC leagues and it all comes out in the wash. But when you're playing H2H or the 3 week races, you almost have to hit at QB to win. I can have a WR put up 6 points in the FFPC and still have a very competitive team. But if my QB has a bad game, it's very difficult to make up that ground. So in my mind the NFFC is a QB league. It's odd saying that the day after Jamaal goes for 57 points but that is not normal. QB's of all abilities are putting up huge games in the NFFC scoring system.

My preference and it's only a preference is 4 points per passing TD. I think it makes the H2H and 3 week race much more balanced. I can't think of anything else I would change with the scoring. I think everything is very well done.


Wayne

And I almost forgot - congrat to the teams who scored well this week! I'm cheering on my buddy Jack Haan who is having a great post season in the prime time!

[wiljiro]

[/quote]
Did your "wait on a QB" draft strategy also tell you that Matt Flynn would lose the starting gig for the second time in two years, yet somehow end up starting for the Packers this late? Or that after his horrible play the past few games, he'd somehow go off in the 2nd half vs. DAL yesterday too, despite once again sucking for the entire first half?

I'm sorry, but when 8 or 9 QBs in a single playoff week are absolute scrubs, I think the scoring format needs a tweak.[/quote]


Yeah - you are right - you are absolutely right - and Tyler Eifert outscored Jimmy Graham this week - So maybe we should revamp how TE's score their points as well -

It's a crap shoot the last three weeks - And for the record - I started Flynn against the Lions, and it cost my team 7 grand - We would have run away with the playoffs - I stand by the decision, and it was the right play -

The QB on the most rosters in the top 25 of Primetime is Nick Foles - Deal with it -

W

[BillyWaz]

After I started this thread, I thought more about it, and just thought "anything can happen.....you just have to understand that."

Then I thought more and came to the following conclusion regarding the QB's (and this really would be the same to lesser degree in 4 point leagues)....

Drew Brees, Peyton Manning, etc. are GREAT, stable, week to week players that will easily HELP (not guarantee of course) you get to the championship round. However in a 3 week sprint, they lose their value quickly, as many other QB's can easily outperform them.

So basically, if you build your teams around a stud QB, they can help you GET to the playoffs (and some of that guaranteed $$), but once there, you probably want to go with someone else.

I took Drew Brees in the 2nd round of my Classic this year, and the 1st round last year. In both years, I had most points in my league, and made some $$$$. Last year, my team "limped" in the playoffs, and had no chance from the start. This year, I liked my chances a whole lot more, but started Brees over Foles yesterday Depending on what Joique Bell does tonight, I may be in line for some top 8 $$$, but certainly not counting on it.

If QB's stay at 6 (which I imagine they will), I may have to tweak my strategy a bit next year, but that is what this game is all about......constantly changing strategies.

[wiljiro]

Very sound words Billy...... Good luck this week

[ForLoveOfTheGame]

Off topic one sec: How was Matt Flynn seriously not benched at some point this year? I would have 100% benched him before half time this week. Along with Thanksgiving (And I needed him so bad that day). I couldn't believe it when he started after halftime. And I was 10000% in favor of them signing him...

GREAT post Wayne! Except that part where you just HAD to throw in Stafford's low (that's a career low game by the way... watching Matt Cassel go OFF vs Philly yesterday was like pouring salt in my wounds thinking about what Stafford could have done vs Philly, and ESPECIALLY Calvin)!

The team in first place in OC took a 0 out of his TE and he's in first place still. You aren't winning a contest at the NFFC with hundreds of people in it with a 0 out of your QB but you can absorb a zero at any other position. Tom just posted the remaining players in the Primetime, look at all the Stafford's at the bottom, even with his best score of the season tonight those teams are DONE. Sandman's list was one of the hardest things I've ever had to look at in fantasy football terms (great work on your excel sheets btw Sandman! and good catch on me forgetting to take out Charles catches a few posts ago!). It's why I think the payout for leading for 13 weeks should be way higher (like 10k+ but I know, that takes away from the carrot that draws customers in so it'll never happen) and why I often wonder if the grand prize race should be longer. Like in 12 team leagues you play everyone once and then have a 5 week playoff instead of 2 weeks of all play. Obviously the shorter it is the more luck plays a part. I think Billy's idea that the regular season average should be weighted more for the playoffs is the best idea I've heard on here in awhile but that's just my opinion.

Have passing TD's or yardage ever been included in the survey that is sent out at the end of every year? I would just be curious to know how the vote came out (or would come out)? And make no mistake, that's not me beating the drum to change it, just asking if there are some numbers out there

[Sandman62]

Yeah - you are right - you are absolutely right - and Tyler Eifert outscored Jimmy Graham this week - So maybe we should revamp how TE's score their points as well -

I think you missed my and Wayne's points? It's not just the NUMBER of "random" players who outscore better players each week, it's the SCORES they put up.

This week's top-10 TEs (so far):
Rk Player Pts
1 Wright, Tim (TB) 21.2
2 Walker, Delanie (TEN) P 19.3
3 Davis, Vernon (SF) 18.9
4 Quarless, Andrew (GB) 18.6
5 Gonzalez, Tony (ATL) Q 18.2
6 Ertz, Zach (PHI) 17.7
7 Witten, Jason (DAL) 17.1
8 Lewis, Marcedes (JAX) 15.4
9 Cumberland, Jeff (NYJ) 14
10 Olsen, Greg (CAR) P 13.8

This week's top-10 QBs:
Rk Player Pts
1 Smith, Alex (KC) 45.0
2 Foles, Nick (PHI) 43.5
3 Fitzpatrick, Ryan (TEN) 42.3
4 Cassel, Matt (MIN) 37.0
5 Flynn, Matt (GB) 36.6
6 Tannehill, Ryan (MIA) 33.5
7 Cousins, Kirk (WAS) 32.0
8 Cutler, Jay (CHI) P 28.3
9 Manuel, EJ (BUF) 28.3
10 Brady, Tom (NE) P 28.2

In Standard QB Scoring, those same QBs would've scored:
Rk Player Pts
1 Smith, Alex (KC) 33.2
2 Foles, Nick (PHI) 31.2
3 Fitzpatrick, Ryan (TEN) 30.3
4 Cassel, Matt (MIN) 29.2
5 Flynn, Matt (GB) 25.7
6 Tannehill, Ryan (MIA) 24.4
7 Cousins, Kirk (WAS) 23.2
8 Cutler, Jay (CHI) P 19.7
9 Manuel, EJ (BUF) 23.4
10 Brady, Tom (NE) P 20.6

Which do you feel affects game outcomes more - TE or QB scoring format?

[chriseibl]

Don't feel too strongly on the subject either way...

PROS for 6 points
Encourages others to take QBs early which runs counter to my typical strategy
Without it, QB can be a position you can very easily completely ignore (which seems to run counter from how football actually works)
Touchdowns just make sense to people at 6 points

CONS for 6 points
More randomness from week to week (for H2H or 3 week playoffs)

[chriseibl]

Off topic one sec: How was Matt Flynn seriously not benched at some point this year? I would have 100% benched him before half time this week. Along with Thanksgiving (And I needed him so bad that day). I couldn't believe it when he started after halftime. And I was 10000% in favor of them signing him...

GREAT post Wayne! Except that part where you just HAD to throw in Stafford's low (that's a career low game by the way... watching Matt Cassel go OFF vs Philly yesterday was like pouring salt in my wounds thinking about what Stafford could have done vs Philly, and ESPECIALLY Calvin)!

The team in first place in OC took a 0 out of his TE and he's in first place still. You aren't winning a contest at the NFFC with hundreds of people in it with a 0 out of your QB but you can absorb a zero at any other position. Tom just posted the remaining players in the Primetime, look at all the Stafford's at the bottom, even with his best score of the season tonight those teams are DONE. Sandman's list was one of the hardest things I've ever had to look at in fantasy football terms (great work on your excel sheets btw Sandman! and good catch on me forgetting to take out Charles catches a few posts ago!). It's why I think the payout for leading for 13 weeks should be way higher (like 10k+ but I know, that takes away from the carrot that draws customers in so it'll never happen) and why I often wonder if the grand prize race should be longer. Like in 12 team leagues you play everyone once and then have a 5 week playoff instead of 2 weeks of all play. Obviously the shorter it is the more luck plays a part. I think Billy's idea that the regular season average should be weighted more for the playoffs is the best idea I've heard on here in awhile but that's just my opinion.

Have passing TD's or yardage ever been included in the survey that is sent out at the end of every year? I would just be curious to know how the vote came out (or would come out)? And make no mistake, that's not me beating the drum to change it, just asking if there are some numbers out there

Didn't someone win just 2 years ago taking a 0 at the QB position in week 16 (forgot if it was Classic or Primetime)

[ForLoveOfTheGame]

I said a contest with hundreds of people in it. I believe you are referring to Classic with around 50-55 teams. That QB might have been Romo? I don't know that for sure, just a foggy memory guess. That's why I constantly say the Classic contest is HANDS DOWN the best fantasy football contest in the world. You aren't playing the perfect lineup game like you are in soooooo many others

[chriseibl]

I said a contest with hundreds of people in it. I believe you are referring to Classic with around 50-55 teams. That QB might have been Romo? I don't know that for sure, just a foggy memory guess. That's why I constantly say the Classic contest is HANDS DOWN the best fantasy football contest in the world. You aren't playing the perfect lineup game like you are in soooooo many others

I agree with that and I also love your idea for rewarding the regular season more (though from an operators perspective it's a whole lot less sexy than increasing the grand prize).

There's also the issue of, should you be able to get away with not having a successful QB. QB is supposed to be a lot more than TE as a position. Love reading everyone's take, I actually think 4 per QB leads to a less random, more rewarding contest. However, the primary reason I support 6 points per QB is this is the one contest I see people taking QBs high and as someone with no interest in doing that as a strategy, it helps me go against the grain.